Sunday, May 27, 2007

Deep Stupidity and the Medicine for a Nightmare (5.13.10)

Unintelligent people are usually just plain wrong, so we don't have to worry much about them. On the other hand, in order to attain truly deep stupidity, one must generally be of above average intelligence. Therefore, in a certain very real sense, intelligence does not vary inversely with stupidity, but directly with it. Not for nothing has it been said that so much philosophy is simply "error on a grandiose scale."

A prime example of deep stupidity and grandiose error is Marxism and all of its many polluted streams, branches, creeks and crocks. That variants of this falsehood still proliferate on the left today means that, as always, intelligence alone is no unknowculation against evil, darkness, and error. Hardly.

For conservative "classical" liberals, we are generally faced with an odious choice between the stupid party and the evil party. We generally align ourselves with the former, since the former is at least susceptible to our influence, whereas the latter is not. Someone who has truly given himself over to evil is not going to be persuaded by truth. His intelligence is in the service of forces he neither sees nor understands, and there is just no point of entry in dealing with him, since he is not lacking information as such but light. Truly, you can hand them the truth on a silver platter, and they will not only reject it but be quite hostile to it.

There are many way to react to truth, only one of which is quiet acceptance. Truth is not just true, but a force. This is why it elicits such strong reactions in people. You will have undoubtedly noticed that when you comprehend a deep truth, there is a pleasant physical sensation that goes along with it -- hard to describe (Christopher Bollas calls it "the erotics of being"), but if you could amplify its vibrations, it would feel like getting the punch line of a joke, or the parts of your being lining up like iron filings, or perhaps properly hitting a baseball. If you hit the ball too close to your hands or too far toward the end of the bat, it's an unsatisfying feeling even if you get a base hit. But there is a feeling of deep satisfaction if you smack a troll right on the "sweet spot" of Hoarhey's cluebat.

Another way of saying it is that Truth is a presence. This is something all Raccoons will know by experience, but will make no sense to the leftist -- for whom it will literally be a meaningless statement. To suggest that Truth once dwelled among us -- and still does -- is the height of absurdity. But truth is the link between Being and knowing. Thus, to say, for example, that Christ is the truth is to say that he is a humanifestation of the divine presence, and vice versa. It's actually very simple, but simple isn't easy, much less simplistic.

Truth is not only not accepted by most people, but it seems to engender a counter-force that is actively hostile to it. This may seem like a controversial statement, but it is the stock in trade of psychoanalysis, which essentially comes down to a study of the varieties of self-deception, or the ways in which one part of the mind pulls the wool over another part. Think about that for a moment, and I think you'll agree that it is quite remarkable -- how the left brain literally doesn't know what the right brain is doing.

I say "literally" because there is good evidence that what we call the unconscious is actually "lodged," so to speak, in the nonverbal -- but also transverbal -- right brain. Every patient comes into treatment with what I call a "likely story." This explicit story is located in the left brain, the seat of language, aristotelian logic, and linear time. However, the right brain has its own story to tell, but how do you tell a story in the absence of verbal language? You do so in the form of symptoms, or quirky character traits, unexplainable likes and dislikes, unaccountable mood storms, obsessions, compulsions, or self-defeating behaviors that the left brain is powerless to stop. This is because every self-defeating behavior is ipso facto a self-fulfilling behavior for a part of the mind of which we are not consciously aware. "There's no success like failure, and failure's no success at all," sang Zimmie.

Freud stumbled upon the method of free association with which to try to understand the various agendas of the mind that ran counter to truth and were the source of psychological pain and dysfunction. There is no great mystery to free association, in which the patient lies down and tries to say whatever comes to mind without censoring it. It is simply a way to try to lull the left brain to sleep and allow the right brain to come out of the shadows. Sounds easy, but every step along the way is met with resistance which can become labyrinthine in its ability to prevent the discovery of the truth.

Here again this is remarkable, for it means that the part of the mind that is resisting must know the truth on some level, otherwise there would be no reason to resist it. Therefore, as Bion pointed out, the truth is prior to the lie, just as light must be prior to the shadow. Indeed, Bion went so far as to say that only the Lie requires a thinker -- and actually brings the thinker into being. On the other hand, truth requires only our accession to it. We simply "bow before reality" -- which, when you think about it, is an excellent way of putting it, for reverent bowing is one of the appropriate responses to the force, or presence, of truth.

Schuon said something similar when he wrote that "A truth is efficacious to the extent that we assimilate it; if it does not give us the strength we need, this merely proves we have not grasped it. It is not for the truth to be 'dynamic,' it is for us to be dynamic thanks to the truth. What is lacking in today’s world is a penetrating and comprehensive knowledge of the nature of things; the fundamental truths are always accessible, but they could not be imposed on those who refuse to take them into consideration."

Ho!

Among other responses, truth engenders a dynamic sense of veneration -- a sense of the sacred. And this is why you will have noticed that the left attempts to surround so many of its moldy lies with the penumbra of sanctity. But the sanctity is entirely bogus -- it readily slides into the sanctimony that is intrinsic to the left. In a perverse way, this sanctimoniousness answers the human need for the sacred, but in an alternatively crudely sentimental or authoritarian manner enforced by the many varieties political correctness. (You will notice that the left's confusion of sentimentality with moral/religious depth is just as evident as their totalitarian mind control; they are not opposites but complementary -- like Hitler's sentimental love of dogs.)

This is why the left doesn't really have ideas but icons -- including "iconic ideas." It is an insidious and sinister process, because there is great psychological pressure on all us of to bow down before these false gods, as if they were actually sacred (for example, the many fawning MSM tributes to "the Goreacle"). And there is absolutely no symmetry in this. For example, if a conservative steps in one of the left's many sacred cowpies, there is a good chance that his career will be ruined. But if a leftist offends what is actually sacred, he will be praised as someone who "speaks truth to power." It is inconceivable that the media would trot out some moral equivalent of Christopher Hitchens to blast Martin Luther King on the occasion of his death because of the latter's embrace of dangerous socialist ideas. For one thing, few conservatives are so tasteless, not to mention enraged.

The point is that nearly every one of the leftists's core beliefs is not a proper idea but an icon, whether it is manmade global warming, being "for the little guy," affirmative action, abortion, homosexual behavior, "peace," "progress," multiculturalism, diversity -- in fact, "progressive" is the quintessence of a meaningless icon, since it bears no relationship to progress and promotes economic and social policies that ensure not just a lack of progress, but regression. For example, the "peace movement" can only bring about more war, just as affirmative action can only bring about harm to blacks.

And this is why it is so easy to be a conservative, because you no longer have to contort yourself with so many lies in order to be thoroughly consistent, both internally and externally. The left confuses their contortions with "nuance," but nuance is simply the left left brain's feeble attempt to keep reality at bay, which inevitably seeps in through the walls, ceilings, and floorboards. Or as Randy Newman sang,

Guilty, baby I’m guilty
And I’ll be guilty the rest of my life
How come I never do what I’m supposed to do
How come nothin’ that I try to do ever turns out right?

You know, you know how it is with me baby
You know, I just can’t stand myself
And it takes a whole lot of medicine
For me to pretend that I’m somebody else

This medicine is called leftism, but it has never actually cured anyone, much less a nation of people. Instead it rapidly worsens the disease it is intended to cure, so that greater and greater doses are required until the patient perishes -- if not literally, then in spirit, as we see in western Europe.

"It takes a whole lot of medicine for me to pretend I’m somebody else." Yes, it takes a whole lot of affirmative action for the leftist to pretend he's not a racist, and a whole lot of diversity to pretend he isn't intolerant of dissent. It takes a whole lot of coddling illegal immigrants to pretend they don't just want the votes, and whole lot of global warming to pretend they don't want to undermine the engine of global capitalism and progress. It takes a whole lot of outrage at President Bush to pretend they aren't allied with the Islamo-fascists, and a whole lot of talk about the "little guy" to pretend they aren't filled with class envy. And it takes a whole lot of multiculturalism to pretend they don't hate American culture and values, and a whole lot of fearful talk of separation between God and state to pretend they don't hate the former and love the latter.

Yeah boy, it takes a whole lot of moral relativism to pretend they're not immoral, and even more education to pretend they're not wrong.

76 Comments:

Anonymous tunguska said...

Baha 'Ullah has said:

"The seeker ought to avoid any preference of himself to another; he should efface pride and arrogance from his heart, arm himself with patience and endurance and follow the law of silence so that he may keep himself from vain words."

5/27/2007 08:41:00 AM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

That would be the B'ab. Not to be confused with the B'ob.

5/27/2007 08:54:00 AM  
Anonymous hoarhey said...

Bob,
Perhaps you could do a (another) post on the leftists inability to separate the objectively spoken, self evident truth from a personal, ego identification with words and the resultant projection of that identification upon others.

Oh, nevermind.

5/27/2007 08:58:00 AM  
Blogger juliec said...

Bob, in what section of the bookstore would I find the Coonifesto? My niece might be interested, but I couldn't find it yesterday.

5/27/2007 09:15:00 AM  
Blogger Gagdad Bob said...

Oh, probably in no section. There would be no reason for a bookstore to carry a book that they won't be able to get rid of. Best to try amazon. And of course, a handful of signed copies are still available from the author....

5/27/2007 09:27:00 AM  
Blogger Robin Starfish said...

Yeah boy, it takes a whole lot of moral relativism to pretend they're not immoral, and even more education to pretend their not wrong.

The Ties That Blind
i'm ok you're not
me and all my relatives
believe in belief

5/27/2007 09:45:00 AM  
Blogger MizzE said...

I noticed the image of the force being transmitted in Dupree's Righteous Spin of the Day - *Nice* Kinda like the feelin' I get here everyday.

5/27/2007 09:52:00 AM  
Anonymous Cousin dupree said...

You know, I hadn't listened to that record in over 30 years, but I picked up a used copy the other day and it might be the most successful fusion of rock and orchestral elements, along with Procol Harum Live with the Edmonton Symphony Orchestra....

5/27/2007 09:59:00 AM  
Anonymous Cousin dupree said...

You will notice that the "ruby slippers" are a symbol of femininity and therefore Sophia, or the divine wisdom which is always available to us. The Wicked Witch of the West is obviously Marxism, what with the hands that are green with envy and try to appropriate the force of truth. (Elvira Gulch was an early feminist heroine, in that she "owned half the county" and obviously needed a man less than her bicycle... or broom stick -- plus, she was "melted" by the water of truth, just like Rosie.)

5/27/2007 10:05:00 AM  
Anonymous Petey said...

Oh yes, and Dorothy is "Door of Theo," or God, while Elvira is "el (the) virus."

5/27/2007 10:08:00 AM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

... and tapping the shoes three times is the Trinity, while the "hot air balloon" of the Wizard is an ironic reference to the hot air of populist demagogues....

5/27/2007 10:11:00 AM  
Anonymous petey said...

... and the winged monkeys are the anti-intellectual Darwinians....

5/27/2007 10:13:00 AM  
Blogger MizzE said...

Woooo - Petey, Cous. I'm pulling those words together into a nice little afterward document to cement onto the back cover of Baum's classic, along with America's song lyrics,"Tin Man", which includes the line "Oz didn't give nothing to the Tin Man that he didn't already have."

5/27/2007 10:30:00 AM  
Blogger Gagdad Bob said...

A beautiful example of how the atheist literally has no idea what we are talking about, any more than a dog can understand music.

5/27/2007 10:33:00 AM  
Blogger MizzE said...

"The Wicked Witch of the West is obviously Marxism, what with the hands that are green with envy and try to appropriate the force of truth."

The force which cannot be imposed is The Shield from those trying to appropriate and would you say the Good Witch of the East is the Holy Spirit?

5/27/2007 10:43:00 AM  
Anonymous Petey said...

Good and therefore beautiful: G-linda (linda meaning beautiful).

5/27/2007 10:46:00 AM  
Blogger Robin Starfish said...

...any more than a dog can understand music...

or a turkey can understand Thanksgiving.

5/27/2007 10:56:00 AM  
Blogger Gagdad Bob said...

I feel sorry for the callow lad -- trying to shoot at the big issues with the light artillery of obligatory atheism.

5/27/2007 11:04:00 AM  
Blogger MizzE said...

Here's a tune from one with ears and who sings in tongues and is most definitely not inClined to listen to anything except to that which is given to him.

5/27/2007 11:10:00 AM  
Blogger walt said...

From the article Bob linked:

"Some people haven't learned to live with the ambiguity and uncertainty that comes with a complete absence of god-given roles or places."

I take issue with the meaning of "to live."

5/27/2007 11:11:00 AM  
Anonymous ximeze said...

Bob:
Checked out your 'beautiful link' & could barely tear my eyes away from his pic, small as it is, to try to read what he wrote.

Need not have bothered, the pic tells the whole story. Poor dear, what could he have been thinking....?

That that arch-look was flattering, or it makes him look smart, or.....?

Can't shake off the image of the 'large broomstick poking where the sun don't shine' that immediately came to mind.

wv: jfxmfp
That settles it! Now wv is providing sound effects to go with that horrible mental image......

5/27/2007 11:22:00 AM  
Anonymous ximeze said...

Ok, it's confirmed. wv CANNOT be random, but IS intelligent! It knows, It gnos!!!!

wv: fibwrb

OMG

wv: nubzdtlc

5/27/2007 11:29:00 AM  
Anonymous philament said...

Leftists seems to develop a persona similar to all the other leftists rather than develop an individual personality. This is their integration into the void.

Bob’s point about the Left developing icons rather than ideas seems to be a similar trait. Perhaps, Bob, you could add to your comments. I would like to understand this phenomenon a little better.

5/27/2007 11:38:00 AM  
Anonymous will said...

>>Truth is not only not accepted by most people, but it seems to engender a counter-force that is actively hostile to it<<

Interesting implication here, I think. There's certainly one helluva "counter-force" at play in the world, I think we can agree.

Where then is the force to which it is countering? Where is its locus? Is it actually embodied at present? Or is its embodiment(s) immiment, getting closer every day?

5/27/2007 11:48:00 AM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

Today it's around second chakra, in the low back... Tomorrow? Who knows....

5/27/2007 11:52:00 AM  
Anonymous WBJ said...

Okay, a poem and a question.

Take this kiss upon the brow!
And, in parting from you now,
Thus much let me avow-
You are not wrong, who deem
That my days have been a dream;
Yet if hope has flown away
In a night, or in a day,
In a vision, or in none,
Is it therefore the less gone?
All that we see or seem
Is but a dream within a dream.

I stand amid the roar
Of a surf-tormented shore,
And I hold within my hand
Grains of the golden sand-
How few! yet how they creep
Through my fingers to the deep,
While I weep- while I weep!
O God! can I not grasp
Them with a tighter clasp?
O God! can I not save
One from the pitiless wave?
Is all that we see or seem
But a dream within a dream?

Me again, not Poe. If something exists, then reality exists, thus truth exists. If hope exists, then something exists, thus reality exists.

If I know hope exists-indeed, if I feel and generate hope- then I can know that reality exists, and thus truth exists. Given that my hope is part of reality, a force in the real world, I can then know MORE truth, or perhaps LESS ignorance, via, at least, my hope.

Am I off here?

WBJ

5/27/2007 11:55:00 AM  
Anonymous will said...

Yup - it's all in the inkoming, the difference between the quickened and the dead.

5/27/2007 11:59:00 AM  
Anonymous dame edith waterfowl said...

Heavens, all I am constrained to say at present is that the spirits are certainly speaking more loudly than ever.

They can be such terribly rude children, you know.

5/27/2007 12:04:00 PM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

WBJ--

Gosh, I don't know. I'll ask Bob. But the Poe-m reminds me of the overture of Eldorado. Was Poe inspired by Jeff Lynne? Yeah, probably. Still, a cooncidence.

The dreamer, the unwoken fool,
In dreams, no pain will kiss the brow.
The love of ages fills the head.
The days that linger there in prey of emptiness,
Of burned out dreams.
The minutes calling through the years.
The universal dreamer rises up above his earthly burden.
Journey to the dead of night.
High on a hill in Eldorado

5/27/2007 12:09:00 PM  
Anonymous Col. J. C. Beaglehole said...

Edith, there isn't enough medicine in the world to help me forget who you are.

5/27/2007 12:11:00 PM  
Blogger walt said...

Bob,
We thought your description of right/left brain interplay, and each having a story to tell, was really fascinating. Felt like we were being let in on professional "trade secrets."

Also, I connected two of your comments - first, "...when you comprehend a deep truth, there is a pleasant physical sensation that goes along with it," and second, "...truth requires only our accession to it. We simply "bow before reality"...for reverent bowing is one of the appropriate responses to the force, or presence, of truth."

As I read the second one, a strong shiver shot up my spine - yikes! - as though my physiology was giving you an "Amen!"

Strong medicine!

5/27/2007 02:28:00 PM  
Blogger Smoov said...

It was a very good example of how these peope (bald atheists) are utterly constrained by what they consider to be "rational".

They are blithely unaware of the myriad a priori assumptions they labor under.

What are you supposed to do with such a person? Ask them to take a year to study that which they cannot now comprehend? Study that which they do not even know that they cannot comprehend?

Few will do so. Most will remain in the dessicated, airless (not to mention quite irrational) hovel of reductionist materialism.

What can I learn from baldy? Bupkus. He literally exhausts himself within a few paragraphs. What can such a man possibly contribute which enhances apprehension of meaning?

Nothing to see here.

Oh, and Baldy: you are so VASTLY beneath the discourse found on this site that you literally don't know it. That's what the "dog/music" comment means. On the other hand, not a few of us were once much like you. In hindsight we know how profoundly wrong we were, but at the time did not know that we did not know. We lived with a scotoma. You must first make the minimal progress of tapping that deeply buried part of yourself which is authentically human. If you can successfully do that there is hope for you. Months if not years of unlearning your current mush-minded logical postivist rubbish, but hope nonetheless.

5/27/2007 02:32:00 PM  
Blogger Mauro C. said...

Hi there,

I would like to invite you, and your readers, to be part of my challenge.

I'm trying to post 1 Million Love Messages From All Around The World in my blog.

I hope that you can help to promote this challenge... and, of course, i'll be waiting for your message :)

Best Regards From Portugal

5/27/2007 02:36:00 PM  
Blogger Joan of Argghh! said...

...every step along the way is met with resistance which can become labyrinthine in its ability to prevent the discovery of the truth.

Here again this is remarkable, for it means that the part of the mind that is resisting must know the truth on some level, otherwise there would be no reason to resist it. Therefore, as Bion pointed out, the truth is prior to the lie..."


This rings like the bell at the end of the ages.


"For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse:

Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened.

Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools..."

5/27/2007 02:48:00 PM  
Blogger Joan of Argghh! said...

Mauro C.:

Please define "love message". We get kinda picky around here.

No, Colonel Beaglehole, he clearly said, message not massage.

5/27/2007 02:51:00 PM  
Anonymous Col. J. C. Beaglehole said...

My dear Mysteress Joan, you've provoked the blessed memory of the occasion of a sensual massage by my blonde Ukranian she-devil.

5/27/2007 03:02:00 PM  
Anonymous ximeze said...

In the vein of Stupid/Smart, Intellect/Mind, Truth/The Lie, I have an personal example from yesterday.

The Setup: I've been moving my stuff from one town to another & have borrowed a ManTruck a couple of times to help with the hauling. It's a stickshift & although I first learned to drive in one, that was many decades ago, so was pretty freeked-out when I got into Truckasaurus the first time.

I remember perfectly firing it up & looking at the all the dashboard displays to orient myself. At that moment, I groked the gas tank was full.

I'd made several trips back & forth & had looked at that fuel indicator many times: always full, and getting FULLER. What a guy! A Magic Truck too.

Still no clue.

On the way back yesterday, Tsaurus started to lurch! OMG, I've broken Randy's beloved. Still clueless.

Managed to limp down an offramp & into a reststop, which contained a gas station. Now, just-plain-dopey is at work. Still no clue.

To misquote Smoov: 'utterly constrained by what they consider to be "True" & blithely unaware of the myriad a priori assumptions they labor under'

THAT FUEL INDICATOR READ EMPTY RIGHT FROM THE START!!!!

Back & forth, back & forth, blithely unaware, laboring under a Lie that my mind could not see.

I swear that until the moment that Beast had coasted to a stop & would not fire-up again, I never, once even, considered that tank anything but FULL.

I take it as an object-lesson on a host of things that involve 'the Lie', be it ever-so-small.

5/27/2007 03:41:00 PM  
Anonymous late convert said...

While dogs can't understand music, they don't try to criticize it either.

This gives them a leg up on many atheists.

5/27/2007 04:49:00 PM  
Blogger Gagdad Bob said...

Exactly. Now one of the bonehead atheists is comparing my writing to the famous "pomo generator." Which only emphasizes my original point that the atheist literally has no earthly idea what we're talking about. Atheism is obviously a confession of ignorance of any plane transcending the senses, but why make a virtue out of it?

5/27/2007 05:47:00 PM  
Blogger MizzE said...

Talk about Deep Stupidity and the Medicine for a Nightmare.

The world premiere of John Taverner's The Beautiful Names will be taking place on 19th June 2007 in Westminster Cathedral.

Quote: "This is the latest in a growing series of compositions influenced by the 'universalist' philosophy of the Swiss mystic and poet Fritjhof Schuon. The work’s title refers to the 99 Names of Allah as culled from the Qur'an and uses adult and boys's voices, celestial trumpets, gongs, drums and Tibetan temple bells to create a unique musical world."

Checking various links within this announcement, I found that this work was commissioned by The Prince of Wales - the personification of dumb dhimmi. Some have even speculated that he has 'reverted'.

If I'm not mistaken Schoun said one must choose one traditional religious orthodoxy as A 'way' - not lump them altogether as having equal value like this group is implying.

The question being asked on the blogs is what are the Muslims going to say about this? Apparently they were not consulted.

5/27/2007 05:52:00 PM  
Anonymous dame edith waterfowl said...

:: Edith, there isn't enough medicine in the world to help me forget who you are::

You would certainly know, wouldn't you, Colonel? Dearie, the only difference between you and a medicine cabinet is that a medicine cabinet doesn't have a fifth of bourbon in it.

5/27/2007 05:54:00 PM  
Blogger walt said...

Bob, you obviously saw the Updates. Just above, you said, "...the atheist literally has no earthly idea what we're talking about."

So, we can assume The Secret is still, er, secret, yes?

5/27/2007 06:00:00 PM  
Anonymous will said...

Re: atheists and their total inability to comprehend the vertical and transcendence - well, we really are talking about two difference species of human being here, you know, literally.

5/27/2007 06:09:00 PM  
Anonymous col. J. C. Beaglehole said...

Yes Edith, I will admit my preference for consorting with Scotch medicine that's been aged 12 years over a British pill who aged me 12.

5/27/2007 06:27:00 PM  
Anonymous late convert said...

Exactly. Now one of the bonehead atheists is comparing my writing to the famous "pomo generator."

Well, bless his heart, he's just doing the best he can to cope with the ambiguity and uncertainty that his beliefs engender.

5/27/2007 06:50:00 PM  
Blogger Gagdad Bob said...

Highrony is just one of the many things lost on them.

5/27/2007 06:58:00 PM  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

This is the time of the tyranny of the brain dead, TV created, every-person, who sits dutifully in front of the insanity machine in the "living" room waiting to be informed about everything and nothing simultaneously.

The masses of every-person, have as a collective, become merely another ego-driven, manipulatable, chaotic, and entirely mad entity. A kind of lunatic herd, a chaos of gross collectivity---how many hundreds of millions of people world wide are watching TV right NOW. This terrible herd knows no limits and most of what it "knows" is entirely false.

In the now of this collective insanity, every individual wallows in the consumerist self-idea, demanding immediate satisfaction of the every wanting-need and random impulse in the mody-mind, and threatening all others with consequences if the consumer self is found still wanting or unsatisfied at end of day.

The neighbourhood wars between all egos, tribes, and cults are what is happening now. The private wars of the consumer every-person, even justified with his righteous religiosity is what is happening now. Brought to one and all in full colour and surrond sound on TV.

Tv has created, and continues to create a world wide mono-culture which is a one dimensional linearity of sameness in which are traditional spiritually based expressions of human culture have been reduced to rubble.

If this mad collective insanity of TV created every-person continues unchecked, the present time of human history will be the end of humantime.

5/27/2007 06:59:00 PM  
Blogger MizzE said...

wvsvq
word veri says visitor quacky

Sheees - I just finished reading in Wiki about the extinct Dodo bird of Mauritius and I come over here and find one alive and quacking.

xicdl - see what I mean?
erpyw

5/27/2007 07:39:00 PM  
Blogger Susannah said...

Bob, your post hit home for me today. What you said about truth being a force and a presence, and especially your professional insight into self-deception....well, let's just say my left brain has been completely bamboozled by my right brain lately. You echoed hubby's insights today. It's not for me to reason why (or, more accurately, engage in self-justification or self-manufactured angst), but to accede to/bow before the Truth.

Thank you!

Also, what Joan said.

wv: nublr. Make what you will of it.

5/27/2007 07:39:00 PM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

Alan, I am Bob's housekeeper. I have determined that if you cared at all about truth, you wouldn't say that Bob ever called atheists animals. If you can make a comment that is not scurrilous, then I won't delete it. Unless it exceeds the banality limit, which may pose an insurmountable obstacle in your case.

5/27/2007 07:49:00 PM  
Anonymous jwm said...

Ah- Holy Cow, there is so much I'd like to write about, but I've been doing a steady forty hour work week for these last couple. It has been hard. I've just been too tired to post anything. But I've been taking in this last weeks posts on intelligence, It has given me much to think on, and not a small part of it is discomforting. Intelligence. I've been accused of having it, but the choices I've made in life, and the consequences of those choices, have helped me beat the rap every time. That always leads me to the parable of the talents. That one is a tough pill to swallow.

Here's a thought that's been roaming around in my head lately. I'm going to try and get it roped in here-
The potential for an orchard of a million trees lies dormant in a single seed. But that potential can only be realized with the firm, and disciplined guidance of a greater hand. It is the will of God that life should flourish. Unlike the seed we must willingly submit. One serious component of the Jesus willies is the inability to discern the difference between submitting to the will of God, and submitting to tyrany. "You mean God's gonna tell me what to do and not do? Screw that!"
Or: You can't prove to my satisfaction that there is a God."
"Well, ya' got me there buddy."

Having said that. Has anyone invited Baldylocks to come play with the coons? I saw River stopped by over there.

wv: gosuq I kid thee not!

5/27/2007 07:54:00 PM  
Anonymous alan said...

Cousin Dupree: Did someone use my id "Alan" today? - I've been out all day and wouldn't want there to me any confusion between me (who was an early financial support of Bob's to the tune of one One Cosmos!) and someone who came forward supporting atheism (Like that Austin dude who won't blog in a place where comments are allowed).

If so, I guess I need a google id.

5/27/2007 08:19:00 PM  
Anonymous jwm said...

Van: In case Austin pays us a visit, I hear that Skully has obtained from an ancient mystical guru in Uru Uru, a bunch of whack-a-troll indulgences. They work like carbon credits allowing you to freely swing the cluebat without backsliding on your program of recovery.
;)

JWM

5/27/2007 08:24:00 PM  
Anonymous Cousin dupree said...

Alan:

Don't worry, no one has misappropriated your good name. We were visited by an atheist drone named Alan who -- of all people -- presumes to instruct us about That of which he knows less than nothing.

5/27/2007 08:51:00 PM  
Anonymous duffy the musical dog said...

I visited the 'beautiful example' and there are comments there which prove all over again that even simple language such as, "...the atheist literally has no idea what we are talking about, any more than a dog can understand music.," is completely misunderstood and taken as viscious insult.

Amazing.

5/27/2007 09:02:00 PM  
Anonymous duffy said...

"It is impossible to speak in such a way that you cannot be misunderstood." -- Karl Popper

5/27/2007 09:06:00 PM  
Blogger Gagdad Bob said...

Exactly. How could someone possibly be so stupid as to miss my point, unless they are simply determined to adopt the role of whining victim? Not very befitting a hardened atheist.

5/27/2007 09:07:00 PM  
Anonymous high priest of mu said...

I find a certain austere and terrible beauty in the plight of an atheist; she has taken the terrible hard road upon herself and makes suffering her canvas and fear her artform.

Anyone can relax into faith and God; these takes no special tapas or will, and lead to warmth and ease--but to block God is to take the act of the worldly stage to its most extreme.

It is hard to imagine that God does not watch his blindest children with a certain element of appreciation; they alone are taking the terrestrial gambit of hide-and-seek to its highest expression.

These souls have elected to show what happens when the veil is at its thickest and most impenetrable; God hides from himself and learns the joy of self-re-discovery.

The person who moves from atheism to God-realization in a single lifetime is the greatest player on the stage of life. How many of you raccoons match? Quite a few, I'll wager.

5/27/2007 10:00:00 PM  
Blogger Susannah said...

I read the update over there. Yup, some deliberate "misunderstanding" taking place. :)

I have yet to grasp the truth claims of atheism. Whence comes the revelation that there is no God? Based on...??

A person who repudiates all but the natural cannot claim any special revelation over the rest of us poor, finite saps. I mean, barring grace, not a single one of us begins to know what we don't know. Surely a materialist confesses that his knowledge is bound closely by the data his five senses transmit to his brain. Seems like that would engender a little bit of humility.

Note that, even with only sensation to guide us, we are deemed "without excuse" and "fools" to deny God. (Interesting that ingratitude plays into it as well: "...neither were thankful....")

Any person with eyes in his head has to work pretty dang hard and twist his mind into a pretzel to deny a Cause for what he sees in nature's open book. It's hard for me to accept that what is so self-evident, another can claim as evidence for nullity. So, I can't believe my lying eyes because *who* says so? Christopher Hitchens et al.? Who are they but self-anointed authorities on all metaphysical matters, which they deny exist? I honest-to-goodness don't get it. Like I said, I'm a peg or three lower than the other brainier folks who post here.

Now, what I can understand is being ticked-off at God. I've been ticked-off at Him before--not that I was ever under the illusion that I had any right to be, but feelings are feelings...and not that I ever was nearly mad enough to say "I'm through with You." (Laughable, the idea of the pot saying so to the potter.)

I can also understand being ticked-off at Christians. Boy howdy, yes I can, and yes I have been. The thing is: 1) I was just as wrong as they were, as apparently I had a goat to get; and 2) the worst possible thing they could do, the basest betrayal, would not change one iota God's extension of Himself to me, and my accountability before Him.

Atheism's always seemed to me to be the stoniest possible path to avoiding that accountability. It must be excruciating to be so oppositional all the time. Why not just claim ignorance, and be agnostic? It requires less hubris.

In the end, as always, it seems to come down to enthroning the "gut" over God. The atheist can't make truth claims about anything outside his sensations, and what he senses is somehow incumbent upon me? On whose authority? I dinna think so. I can't help but conclude that I would far rather accept the light of divine revelation (more to be desired than fine gold and sweeter than honey, as David deemed it) than the contents of the atheist's blind gut.

5/27/2007 10:50:00 PM  
Blogger USS Ben USN (Ret) said...

Zounds!
Alan Mackenzie was even more banal than that Austin dude, which I didn't think was possible!
Evidently the depths of banality possible within atheism has no limit.

Actually, it probably does, but after seein' that elitist display of sheer stupidity I have seen more than I want to know about the level of intellectual depravity possible in atheist anality.

5/28/2007 12:31:00 AM  
Blogger USS Ben USN (Ret) said...

"But there is a feeling of deep satisfaction if you smack a troll right on the "sweet spot" of Hoarhey's cluebat."

Or, as is the case with these atheists, kinda like puttin' salt on slugs.

5/28/2007 12:35:00 AM  
Blogger USS Ben USN (Ret) said...

"But truth is the link between Being and knowing. Thus, to say, for example, that Christ is the truth is to say that he is a humanifestation of the divine presence, and vice versa. It's actually very simple, but simple isn't easy, much less simplistic."

Truth is the missing link that atheist keep lookin' for.
No wonder they haven't found it yet.

5/28/2007 12:39:00 AM  
Blogger USS Ben USN (Ret) said...

Skully says:
These atheists have all the symptoms of post-part'em depression without the intelligence.

5/28/2007 12:43:00 AM  
Blogger USS Ben USN (Ret) said...

"Here again this is remarkable, for it means that the part of the mind that is resisting must know the truth on some level, otherwise there would be no reason to resist it."

Exactly! Why else would atheists and leftists protest too much on every topic that contains one iota of truth in it?

BTW B'ob, that was hilarious when Mr. Mackenzie claimed you took his free speech away! Heh!
This from a guy who doen't know where liberty comes from, let alone what it means.

Who knew B'ob had that much power?

5/28/2007 12:53:00 AM  
Blogger USS Ben USN (Ret) said...

"And this is why you will have noticed that the left attempts to surround so many of its moldy lies with the penumbra of sanctity. But the sanctity is entirely bogus -- it readily slides into the sanctimony that is intrinsic to the left. In a perverse way, this sanctimoniousness answers the human need for the sacred, but in an alternatively crudely sentimental or authoritarian manner enforced by the many varieties political correctness."

Or, as Oswald Chambers puts it, they are:
"Sanctimonious prigs."

5/28/2007 01:06:00 AM  
Blogger walt said...

Whew!
Thanks, Dupree; I wasn't sure what I'd just read on the way to Sleepytime, and I wasn't sure what I'd wake up to, either!

I'll "bow before reality," and say that I arrive in the mornings with the same look in my interior eye as that little raccoon: "And he showed me a pure river of water of life, clear as crystal...." If that appears sycophantic, well, so be it.

I can read, and can make distinctions, and having read much of the a-theist's blog yesterday, I think I'll just hang-out over here, if I may.

Susannah echoed a perception I had from 30 years ago, that no opinion "would change one iota God's extension of Himself to me, and my accountability before Him."

Still trying to catch up to what I knew in that moment.

5/28/2007 04:02:00 AM  
Blogger River Cocytus said...

phew! Well, my work is never done until I've called someone a coward, it seems. It's cathartic in the least, I suppose.

I used to not believe Hume when he said that for instance, if a door slammed, he would not know if the sound was actually a door slamming or something making that noise at the same location, and so on. An atheist can point me to a dictionary to demonstrate what the words they are using mean, but that doesn't prove they mean that - the dictionary could be completely made up! There could be no meaning at all to any of the words they think they are using.

Without the transcendent, of course. A startling and unusual discovery for me a few months back...

5/28/2007 05:13:00 AM  
Blogger Susannah said...

Walt, yep. :) It's a poor substitute for Reality, a starvation diet for the soul.

The saddest thing about it is, you have to sacrifice your sense of wonder.

I'm a grown woman, and perhaps this is childish, but I still find it astounding that you can stick wings on a metal tube, suck air through turbines, set it on fire, use the thrust to direct that tube to a destination halfway around the globe...and expect with high confidence to arrive safely! Cool!

I am still fascinated by our digital camera...holding in my hands the ability to em-pixellate a slice of time!

I cart the offspring around in a lovely van that runs on controlled explosions!

It's a truly wonderful time to be alive, really. Yet, all these astounding products of human intelligence are so obviously derivative. What is more wonderful? My digital camera, or the human eye? What is more astounding, my beating heart, or my car's engine? How can I be less awed by the wild goose's flight than a mechanical jet engine's? If our best imitations are direct products of intelligence...well.... Hmmm?

I'm not the only person with eyes in her head, which is why atheism will never succeed with most people. That's not to say it can't do a lot of harm (as it has, historically) but then, so does anything that sets itself in opposition to the Good, and it's only fair to say that those wolves can come in sheep's clothing, too.

5/28/2007 05:13:00 AM  
Anonymous will said...

Mu, high priest of -

>>Anyone can relax into faith and God; these takes no special tapas or will<<

Wha? No, I don't really think so, Mister Mu. Faith isn't some kind of suspension of disbelief like watching a movie and conveniently forgetting you're seeing a bunch of actors rattle off lines. That's what atheists believe, tell ya the truth.

Faith is a grace that's given, nobody relaxes into it by will-power. More, faith is actually a perceptual vision as real as any provided by the sense organs. And trust me, if you genuinely have it, it ain't all warm and toasty 24/7 - it brings with it a mine field, a whole array of challenges and trials. You know, picking up your cross, activating your karma, etc.

What are tapas, anyway?

5/28/2007 07:07:00 AM  
Anonymous the defrocked priest of mu said...

Will, "tapas" is a sustained concentrated spiritual effort.

It comes from the Sanskrit.

And I do believe I was in error, which you corrected, about the nature of faith; it is not all warmth and ease.

I generalize and hyperbollized when I write; these are flaws I am working on.

5/28/2007 08:56:00 AM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

Indeed. One of the tasks of the Minister is to fine tune our hyperbole and generalization.

5/28/2007 09:05:00 AM  
Anonymous It takes a pillage said...

It takes a whole lot of self fighteousness to pretend it isn't fear;

It takes a whole load of denial to pretend it isn't you;

It takes a whole lot of name calling before one hears that the echo coming back is calling our own name.

You'll get your time under your own knife, Bob. That's the thing to keep in mind.

5/29/2007 04:17:00 AM  
Anonymous duffy's flea said...

Ooooooh, Bob, you've been admonished by Thom Hartmann!

5/29/2007 04:55:00 AM  
Anonymous cousin dupree said...

Somewhere a pillage is missing its idiot.

5/29/2007 05:30:00 AM  
Blogger Alan Mackenzie said...

This comment has been removed by the author.

5/29/2007 12:24:00 PM  
Blogger River Cocytus said...

It is sine qua non of subhumanism to lower your standards to the point where you cannot be judged because your measure is so low. You then can in your mind freely take hateful shots at everyone else whose standards are higher than your own.

Do you understand the difference between 'The Inner Man' and 'The Outer Man'? Outwardly we are all identical; we are by nature sinful, fallen, tending towards the animal and beastly. Inwardly we all have the potential of returning to our maker; God. However, as the gnostics misunderstood, the outer man does not refer to the body nor does the inner man refer to the soul. Instead, the outward man is LIKE the body, but without the body there could be no inner man. Neither could there be an outer man without the soul. It is an intrinsic duality to our makeup. People experience this commonly with the idea of the 'Cartesian Dualism' I think it is called.

We're a little more complex than that I'd wager, but if you eliminate all but the material you can not distinguish between someone calling you subhuman referring to your potential - I.E. to return to God, and your SPECIES which is clearly identical to our own; homo sapiens.

If Bob is being evasive it is because he understands (as well do I and others) the pointlessness of arguing metaphysics with a materialist.

Now, if Bob says you are LITERALLY subhuman, he refers to what makes homo sapiens, the species our organism is; human and not just another clever animal. What is special about this creature? It is lost to the materialist.

Your inability to distinguish between a claim of spiritual inadequacy and one of racial inferiority proves your ignorance.

I'm sure 'Godbag' doesn't count as a slur anyway; but to one who cannot know the metaphysical it might as well be.

As a Christian I believe there are two types of people in the world: Hypocrites, and hypocrites who are trying to do something about it. It would appear you are the former.

Be well.

5/29/2007 02:51:00 PM  

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