tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post6345810083295429553..comments2024-03-28T20:04:20.286-07:00Comments on One Cʘsmos: Cathedrals of Science and Religion (5.16.09)Gagdad Bobhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comBlogger29125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-36694523419835724882008-05-16T07:49:00.000-07:002008-05-16T07:49:00.000-07:00Sorceror: I would say the best languages are those...Sorceror: I would say the best languages are those that 'have many chefs that <I>don't</I> spoil the pot', no?Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-46765857964579692962008-05-16T07:17:00.000-07:002008-05-16T07:17:00.000-07:00mushroom - Everyone has a built-in talent for lang...mushroom - Everyone has a built-in talent for language, but that doesn't mean that sophisticated language develops spontaneously without any input or guidance. Similarly, everyone has a built-in <A HREF="http://ingles.homeunix.net/rants/atheism/test1.html" REL="nofollow">talent for morality</A> but that doesn't mean that sophisticated morality will develop without input and guidance.<BR/><BR/>Oh - and scientific theories and chess strategies are developed by discrete individuals and then propagated, too.<BR/><BR/>Not challenging, just pointing out a different way to look at things.Ray Ingleshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16290483120987779339noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-62530902988022684302008-05-16T05:47:00.000-07:002008-05-16T05:47:00.000-07:00You know, Van. Those two “pieces” are a great comp...You know, Van. Those two “pieces” are a great comparison. The fact that people can see the difference between those two without even having to know exactly why, that is amazing to me. Just the fact that we can. And instantly, I might add. Amazing too is that you could have pointed to example after example. Because that gap is infinite, as you say. I would argue it doesn’t completely have to do with realism.<BR/><BR/>Rauschenberg's “combine” may be a perfect example of everything outside of what makes art Art. It’s composed and arranged and there are rules, but that’s all it is. Just rules. He grabbed what was around him (which must be the definition of a materialist) and that was it. When does the art show up? It doesn’t. Why did he stop before the art? That is nothing to celebrate.<BR/><BR/>Rauschenberg's shows me what the cosmos would look like without a Creator. It would just be monkeys on typewriters headed toward stop. When you look at “The Rapture of Psyche" doesn’t it make you say “more”? Which is to say “keep going!” I want to see what’s next. I can sense “next” is out there. Rauschenberg’s work will make that “next” look even better by comparison. That doesn’t mean I’m thankful for his work. It’s just a reminder. Work like his is creating a large space behind it where the next Michelangelo or Van Gough or Mozart to work within. And everyone will turn around.Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10589423819039764711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-91531375037010905192008-05-15T21:42:00.000-07:002008-05-15T21:42:00.000-07:00"...except that he tries to spring his cage from b..."...except that he tries to spring his cage from below instead of above. This is certainly possible; the trouble is, there's no floor there, so one tends to keep falling, which, for awhile, gives a kind of thrill from the bracing "movement." This lasts until one begins to notice the gradual absence of both heat and light (i.e., heart and intellect), as one drifts further and further from the central sun which makes the earth humanly habitable. "<BR/><BR/>The sheer deliberate joylessness is what is most confounding, especially since it is so very obvious to anyone with eyes to see the Truth of what creeps in when the Good, the Beautiful and the True are shoved 'out of the way'. <BR/><BR/>To see how far we've fallen, where the rejection of Truth and the denial of our ability to grasp reality leads, compare the transcendent beauty of <A HREF="http://www.artrenewal.org/asp/database/image.asp?id=23" REL="nofollow">William Bouguereau's "The Rapture of Psyche"</A> Oil on canvas, 1895, with the sunken flatness of <A HREF="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/0/0a/Robert_Rauschenberg%27s_untitled_%27combine%27%2C_1963.jpg" REL="nofollow">Rauschenberg's 'combine'</A> from 1963 - only sixty some odd years separate them in time, but as Gagdad might say, the distance between them is infinite.<BR/><BR/>"As someone --Dawson? -- said, you can undo in a matter of weeks what it took millennia to build."<BR/><BR/>True, but the good news is that you <I>can</I> rebuild the Cathedrals within yourself - and make no mistake, they will need to be rebuilt within the populace before there's a chance of seeing them being rebuilt in the world; but sights like <A HREF="http://www.artrenewal.org" REL="nofollow"> Are Renewal</A> do give hope that that reconstruction has begun. For all we decry modernity, and rightly so, it is the one and only time in history, that the evidence of past greatness, and the materials with which to recreate it, have been readily available to anyone curious enough to seek them out, and others of like mind, whether they be next door or across the world - and/or through our Raccoondom of One Cosmos.<BR/><BR/>Hope and Truth can be a powerful combination... especially when you realize that the evil we face is every bit as worthless and insubstantial as rauschenberg's splating. That stands a chance against "The Rapture of Psyche"? <I>Puh-leeze</I><BR/><BR/>(Keep at it Lance - it's worth it!)Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-21370053795468940442008-05-15T21:02:00.000-07:002008-05-15T21:02:00.000-07:00Spork! Or.. Runcible Spoon? They would seem to des...Spork! Or.. Runcible Spoon? They would seem to describe completely different utensils - spork sounds to be made of cheap wood or plastic, while runcible spoon sounds like a wondrous implement made of fine silver. <BR/><BR/>By the way, how about the japanese word for car? 'Kuruma'? Or the greek for enemy, 'exthroi'? There are plenty, I think.Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-36517176033940845882008-05-15T16:22:00.000-07:002008-05-15T16:22:00.000-07:00That reminds me that Mrs. G. and I used to play Sc...That reminds me that Mrs. G. and I used to play Scrabble in such a way that you were allowed to use made up words, so long as you could define it and it sounded like a real word. The only example I can think of at the moment is the bar of soap that's getting too small to use but is still too big to throw away: a <I>slimp</I>.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-28291384348947987852008-05-15T16:16:00.000-07:002008-05-15T16:16:00.000-07:00Over at the Weekly Standard’s website they’ve post...Over at the Weekly Standard’s website they’ve posted online a Joseph Bottom <A HREF="http://www.weeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/015/094mwbwu.asp" REL="nofollow">piece</A> about <I>agenbites</I>—the term he suggests we use for words that sound true of themselves.<BR/><BR/>Sample:<BR/>“<I>Verbose</I> has always struck me as a strangely verbose word,” I note. “<I>Peppy</I> has that perky, energetic, spry sound it needs. And was there ever a more supercilious word than <I>supercilious</I>? Or one more lethargic than <I>lethargic</I>?”<BR/><BR/>Buckaroos prolly wouldn't enjoy learning the history of the word <I>agenbites</I>.QPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15827536245376441948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-1139148366233855312008-05-15T14:38:00.000-07:002008-05-15T14:38:00.000-07:00Some time back I mistakenly ordered two versions o...Some time back I mistakenly ordered two versions of Julian of Norwich's "Showings"; the versions had different titles; one was in the original semi-Middle English and the other was "translated" into modern English. I found the modern version sort of uninspiring. Nothing happened while I was readin it. With the original language I could not read, as in recognize, the original English while reading it silently. But I found that when I read the original out loud I understood the meaning; it was much more vital and penetrating that the modern English. F/Y/IAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-60045642582490769002008-05-15T14:33:00.000-07:002008-05-15T14:33:00.000-07:00It is the intellectual embodiment of the death ins...It is the intellectual embodiment of the death instinct.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-37312450351020550192008-05-15T14:11:00.000-07:002008-05-15T14:11:00.000-07:00I want to stop the destroyers, before they complet...I want to stop the destroyers, before they complete their destruction. <BR/><BR/>(By the way, I tracked down that story. It's called "The Destructors," and it's by Graham Green.)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-25768121328955126112008-05-15T13:56:00.000-07:002008-05-15T13:56:00.000-07:00"Allalivial, allalluvial!" Picked out enough phras...<I>"Allalivial, allalluvial!" </I><BR/><BR/>Picked out enough phrases in Joyce's reading to google for<BR/><A HREF="http://www.trentu.ca/faculty/jjoyce/fw-213.htm" REL="nofollow">the written passages.</A><BR/><BR/>My hearing gleaned more than my seeing.QPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15827536245376441948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-13754490784737723992008-05-15T13:44:00.000-07:002008-05-15T13:44:00.000-07:00But may I quote you on that?But <I>may</I> I quote you on that?Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-6995750599316195522008-05-15T13:40:00.000-07:002008-05-15T13:40:00.000-07:00It has many mansions. You can quote me on that.It has many mansions. You can quote me on that.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-54556302554187739952008-05-15T13:20:00.000-07:002008-05-15T13:20:00.000-07:00As always, I think one's task is to find the cathe...As always, I think one's task is to find the cathedral that hides in plain sight. But also, it is nice to help pitch in in the rebuilding efforts.Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-36954468851142439932008-05-15T12:32:00.000-07:002008-05-15T12:32:00.000-07:00So if the Cathedral comes down in whatever sense.....So if the Cathedral comes down in whatever sense...what is one's best response? Build one's own small chapel (I'm still speaking metaphorically, of course) in which to whether the storm...or does one defiantly pitch in to the rebuilding efforts. (or both?)<BR/><BR/>In that sense I've been puzzling over a phrase GB tossed off a while back "Post-religious Religion". That would seem, to me anyway, to be more of a personal chapel situation than that of building a civilization-defining CATHEDRAL.<BR/><BR/>Any insights to help me light my confusion?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-12378108199052948122008-05-15T12:27:00.000-07:002008-05-15T12:27:00.000-07:00Speaking of hearing, are you ever gonna have your ...Speaking of hearing, are you ever gonna have your book on cd, Bob? <BR/>Read by you of course.USS Ben USN (Ret)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07492369604790651538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-91699313926750033762008-05-15T12:26:00.000-07:002008-05-15T12:26:00.000-07:00JWM - yep on both counts; I don't use the mirror v...JWM - yep on both counts; I don't use the mirror very often, but after this week I think I'll try to make a habit of it.juliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15975754287030568726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-43583984795271542032008-05-15T11:59:00.001-07:002008-05-15T11:59:00.001-07:00Here's a priceless excerpt of Joyce reading from F...Here's a priceless excerpt of Joyce reading from <A HREF="http://salonmedia.vo.llnwd.net/o1/mp3s/joyce1.mp3" REL="nofollow">Finnegans Wake</A>, in such a way that you can really sense the musicality and humor. It was meant to be <I>heard</I>, not just read (as is true, BTW of the begending of One Cosmos). (For those you who have the book, this starts with the third to the last paragraph at the very end of Book One.)Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-57215493839693173132008-05-15T11:59:00.000-07:002008-05-15T11:59:00.000-07:00Julie/ Walt:I'm just going to butt in here, and as...Julie/ Walt:<BR/>I'm just going to butt in here, and assume that I know what you're talking about, and presume to have something of worth to say.<BR/>When I was carving stone, an important part of the process for me was to set the work in progress on a marble disc at one end of the table, and then go into the bathroom where I could open the medicine chest door, (there is no screen on the window. We leave it open for the cats)look at the carving table reflected from the back porch- and get a good look at the stone from a great range of angles reflected in the mirror. It pointed out flaws I hadn't noticed, curves that needed snoothing, and areas that needed one thing or another became readily apparent in the mirror view. Great tool!<BR/><BR/>ontheotherhand<BR/>Sometimes looking at your artwork in the mirror has the same effect as hearing your voice on a crappy tape recorder- you know- it kind of gives you the willies.<BR/><BR/>JWMAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-28471786071897291572008-05-15T11:37:00.000-07:002008-05-15T11:37:00.000-07:00Each Archetype functions like a lamp. Take for ins...Each Archetype functions like a lamp. Take for instance the archetype of the 'gang', which is (it seems to me) mostly clearly pictured in 'Lord of the Flies'. The old building in the story is the Archetype of the Cathedral, 'the seat', which each and every church, cathedral, parliament, and college is an 'icon' of. The story of sehoy asks, which if the Gang throws out those who normally occupy the Seat? <BR/><BR/>It seems likely that this is exactly what would happen; they would hollow it out, so they could keep the appearance and prestige without having to deal with the actual 'rules'. Then, whether they wanted it to or not, it would eventually collapse on itself, to the surprise of anyone who had not taken a look inside recently.Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-72454623897803815502008-05-15T11:32:00.000-07:002008-05-15T11:32:00.000-07:00"Ideally, pontifical man is the axis mundi who -- ...<I>"Ideally, pontifical man is the axis mundi who -- like the vertical ray of creation itself -- transverses across all levels of reality, from mystical union above to quantum physics below. As a result of the law of inverse analogy, the paradoxical continuity of the quantum world is a mirror of the highest state of consciousness, in which the many are reconciled into the One."</I><BR/><BR/>Beautiful, Bob.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://robinstarfish.blogspot.com/2008/05/equipoise.html" REL="nofollow">Equipoise</A><BR/>lattice of nine worlds<BR/>intersecting valences<BR/>the artist unpaintsrobinstarfishhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15665546554663005609noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-91384127172680068352008-05-15T11:29:00.000-07:002008-05-15T11:29:00.000-07:00Bob, In Kimball's article on Rauschenberg, toward...Bob, In Kimball's article on Rauschenberg, toward the end, he mentions that only two works at a Guggenheim exhibit revealed any aesthetic emotion. Kimball states they were made at the suggestion of his then wife Susan Weil. In her wiki bio, we learn that "During a period of eleven years Weil experimented with etchings and handmade paper while also keeping a daily notebook of drawings inspired by the writings of James Joyce. Her exhibition, <I>Ear's Eye for James Joyce</I>, was presented at Sundaram Tagore gallery in New York in 2003."<BR/><BR/>From an interview: <BR/><BR/><B>I’ve heard you were exposed to Joyce early in your life.</B><BR/>Well, in my childhood, my father was a writer and he did read to us, unbelievably, from <I>Finnegans Wake</I> when I was a child [laughs]. But I loved it because I loved the music of it and I understood it was his passion and so I thought it was important to me. Of course I didn’t understand a word, being a child, but when I went back to it as an adult I felt that same kind of response to the music of it and the journey of Joyce. It really struck me.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://artnetweb.com/theoricon/weil/index2.html" REL="nofollow">Link</A> to the <I>Ear's Eye for James Joyce</I>, exhibit online; based on various works by Joyce.QPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15827536245376441948noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-30075715943313598852008-05-15T10:09:00.000-07:002008-05-15T10:09:00.000-07:00Sehoy;That's not an allegory of what the tenured c...Sehoy;<BR/><BR/>That's not an allegory of what the tenured children of academia are doing. Rather, it's literally what they're doing.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-29370739118774337272008-05-15T10:07:00.000-07:002008-05-15T10:07:00.000-07:00Today's post - yet another of Bob's intricately be...Today's post - yet another of Bob's intricately beautiful stained glass windows on the east side of the cathedral.<BR/><BR/>Sun's up! Breathtaking.NoMohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01100042056270224683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-19059331533640676012008-05-15T10:03:00.000-07:002008-05-15T10:03:00.000-07:00I was just discussing this subject yesterday with ...I was just discussing this subject yesterday with someone. <BR/><BR/>A few years ago I read a short story for an English class and it was about a gang of kids who were using an abandoned, empty, beautiful old building in a London slum as a gang hang out. One day the leader of the gang decides that the kids will start dismantling the building from the inside. Just because they could. They do it in such a way that no one notices what's happening, until one day the empty shell collapses and the people in the neighborhood are dumbfounded that the building could just collapse like that. What they didn't know is that these kids had gutted the structure until it was just an empty fascade. I recall the name of the story was "The Destroyers." The story keeps coming to mind these days.<BR/><BR/>I was thinking all day about cathedrals yesterday too. What a coincidence.<BR/><BR/>I want to build a copy of this one in Tennessee. <BR/><BR/>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Koelner_Dom_bei_Nacht_1_RB.JPGAnonymousnoreply@blogger.com