tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post2355083011753114091..comments2024-03-27T11:16:36.951-07:00Comments on One Cʘsmos: Does God Suffer? Gagdad Bobhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comBlogger13125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-73749699719104817762013-10-03T05:58:38.141-07:002013-10-03T05:58:38.141-07:00One last thin
Before the conspiracy kicks in:
Tho...One last thin<br />Before the conspiracy kicks in:<br /><br />Thought I should watch the movie Ordinary People again since the boy is having a difficult time with this breakup.<br />The movie is better than I thought. By that I think there is more to it than I realized. Layers of truth sort of thing. Which is likely why the movie was so successful.<br />Among other things, it reflects that scripture about "leaving the mother and clinging to his wife ".<br />If I change the characters around, I think the template holds up when the girlfriend in my sons story is played by the mother. And that the father in the movie is a shadow of the future son in the movie. And so on..Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13720790978632771716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-86635213761823403902013-10-03T05:20:02.564-07:002013-10-03T05:20:02.564-07:00In others words,
The Sorrow through which the Fath...In others words,<br />The Sorrow through which the Father sees me, is the same sorrow through which I see the boyRickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13720790978632771716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-87778187939996584542013-10-02T09:18:19.964-07:002013-10-02T09:18:19.964-07:00There are different ways to suffer. It may be usef...There are different ways to suffer. It may be useful to define what we mean. For example, my son is recovering from a breakup from his girlfriend. He was (is) deeply attached to her. He blames himself for what happened. His mother and I suffer with him. What kind of suffering is his mother's and mine? Perhaps it is a reflection of an aspect of God's kind.Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13720790978632771716noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-7563275358621807152013-10-01T05:42:36.733-07:002013-10-01T05:42:36.733-07:00Everybody gets that backwards these days.
Welcome...<i>Everybody gets that backwards these days.</i><br /><br />Welcome to the USSA.Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00987042455512485699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-10334327129772135982013-09-30T17:58:59.899-07:002013-09-30T17:58:59.899-07:00"Importantly, this does not represent an anth..."Importantly, this does not represent an anthropomorphization of God, but rather, a divinization of man. The same can be said of all man's divine qualities, prerogatives, and responsibilities, including his obligation to truth, his capacity for beauty, his striving for nobility, not to mention all the various flavors of love, e.g., philia, agape, caritas, eros, etc."<br /><br />Everybody gets that backwards these days.<br /><br />JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-62427875103882514142013-09-30T17:54:23.314-07:002013-09-30T17:54:23.314-07:00"Now, what truly and necessarily defines a hu..."Now, what truly and necessarily defines a human? What are the conditions without which we cannot be persons? I think, prior to everything else, we must be intersubjectively open systems. Clearly, the notion of God-as-Trinity reflects this principle, in that the Trinity is not static at all, nor is it closed. Rather, it is the very essence of dynamism, of self-giving, and of receptivity."<br /><br />Persons are also permanent.<br /><br />As I like to say, my problem isn't that I'm mortal.<br /><br />It's that I'm not.<br /><br />And everywhere I go, there I am.<br /><br />I just can't get away from me.<br /><br />And I have a specific geometry. I'm always me, no matter how much I change.<br /><br />I'm always the same and always different. Static and dynamic at the same time.<br /><br />JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-86503096277615106732013-09-30T14:49:54.200-07:002013-09-30T14:49:54.200-07:00RC
I'm concerned about NASA being shut down. ...RC<br /><br />I'm concerned about NASA being shut down. This is unacceptable.<br /><br />I'm hoping it is just a scare that will subside without incident.<br /><br />In the meantime,increased consumption of intoxicants is indicated, starting now, to allay the anxiety.Open Trenchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06354412002318534131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-70802698036009729212013-09-30T13:48:40.253-07:002013-09-30T13:48:40.253-07:00Lots to think about.
Our distinctions of time pas...Lots to think about.<br /><br /><i>Our distinctions of time past, present, and future "hold only from the creaturely point of view." A corollary of this is that God's perspective is "real" whereas ours is fundamentally unreal.</i><br /><br />I'm not sure about this. I'd have ventured to say instead that "God's perspective is complete, whereas ours is fundamentally incomplete." W don't see the entire Film Strip of Created Time all at once, just frame by frame. That doesn't make our view of temporality any less "real," and it sidesteps the whole business of maya/illusion, etc. I know various protestors like Calvin worried about all this, but I haven't cracked the <i>Institutes</i> to really give it serious thought. I've been more interested lately in definitions of "nature."<br /><br />As for God's suffering, I've always thought that since Christ was crucified at a particular moment, God of course sees and suffers that moment eternally, even after the Final Marriage of Heaven and Earth. Golgotha will still be a part of Cosmic History, which I assume would still be a pain in God's heart. <br /><br />In the meantime, down here in the old Magistorium (which needs some serious weatherstripping), I find myself remembering what an old Lutheran pastor once told me, "Never forget that at the heart of the universe is a God who grieves." It makes me feel for the Guy, which is kind of the point.<br /><br />Also, I think it's important and of course difficult to distinguish between suffering and evil. We know that God is love and cannot ordain evil, but His creation clearly produces a whole lot of disfigurement and pain. Birth defects. Tsunami. Cancer. Very difficult in each case to see how human sin brought them on. Maybe it did, in which case God grieves it.<br /><br />What did He say to Job? It's not like Job saw anything unreal. He just didn't see as much as God saw.<br /><br />That's as far as I get with these kinds of questions. Looking forward to hearing others.Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00987042455512485699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-76878512719259555612013-09-30T12:20:09.682-07:002013-09-30T12:20:09.682-07:00There is some paradox in this, though. If we under...There is some paradox in this, though. If we understand God's perfection, eternity, stability and lack of change as being stasis and death, I think maybe it is because we under-estimate the difference between the divine and the human. For instance, if God has a body in Jesus Christ and Christ has a body in the faithful, does it not hold that the body grows - that God is being added to - with each believer that joins him? <br /><br />And perhaps that is what existence is the answer to, the question of "how can the perfect and complete be made more perfect and more complete?"<br /><br />It's definitely orthodox that God suffers through Christ - however you wish to interpret that. It would seem that God knows suffering through Christ although he himself is impassible. If he is not then there is no paradox and perhaps no need even for an incarnation.<br /><br />---<br /><br />So when they shut down the gov't they also shut down NASA which means we get shut down! You know, just when we had all of our bills paid and were sitting on piles of money.<br /><br />Just kidding! We're strapped for cash and hoping that some of the other stuff we do on the side will be worth money at some point but you know, we didn't enter this life with anything and it is more clear day by day that we will not leave it with anything either!Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-91072600907914259002013-09-30T11:51:04.386-07:002013-09-30T11:51:04.386-07:00JOhnny is trapped in a burning ring of fire and ca...JOhnny is trapped in a burning ring of fire and can't respond at this time. Open Trenchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06354412002318534131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-73730954930716591482013-09-30T11:04:26.851-07:002013-09-30T11:04:26.851-07:00...God perfectly receives all that happens in the ...<i>...God perfectly receives all that happens in the world and perfectly responds to it ...</i><br /><br />I like that. The hero does not always know what is coming, but he is always able to meet the challenge and overcome it. Even when it kills him.<br /><br />Christ's suffering was not the end of all suffering -- <a href="http://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?search=colossians%201:24&version=NASB" rel="nofollow">see Colossians 1:24</a> -- <i>... filling up what is lacking in Christ’s afflictions</i>.<br /><br />I wonder what <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SmVAWKfJ4Go" rel="nofollow">Johnny Cash</a> would say?mushroomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07651027035577798096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-22161739244506133232013-09-30T09:45:28.740-07:002013-09-30T09:45:28.740-07:00How would like the question to be answered? What ...How would like the question to be answered? What would feed your soul?<br /><br />I would prefer God suffers, but interprets suffering as pleasure, as a change up from his continuous status of delight.<br /><br />The novelty of suffering, which He cannot achieve without partial self-forgetting, which he obtains through us, is the one of the reason's He made the cosmos.<br /><br />God wants variety, and he wants to be amused. He can't do that without us.<br /><br />This might make God sound trivial, but I think novelty, fun, and diversions are no light-weight matter; they may matter more than "serious" matters. <br /><br />He has to make us forget we are Him. If we remember, then we no longer suffering and God has to get His product from someone else; although he probably welcomes His awakened ones back home to the main body and gives them the option to go back after having their memories wiped again.<br /><br />Such are the intuitions of the Trench; poor fare indeed.<br /><br />Loved the post, so expertly crafted and unique as usual... sorry to post my garbage here. I can't help it, it would seem.<br /><br />I look forward to reading your post each morning. It's a habit like some people read the newspaper.<br /><br />Open Trenchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06354412002318534131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-15138889930176346212013-09-30T09:44:25.752-07:002013-09-30T09:44:25.752-07:00A related issue is whether God suffers. ... I thi...<i>A related issue is whether God suffers. ... I think, prior to everything else, we must be intersubjectively open systems.</i><br /><br />Jesus wept.<br /><br />I was thinking about that last week, on the question of whether God can be surprised. Maybe it's just me, but the idea that he wept upon hearing the news of Lazarus' death would indicate that he can.<br /><br />In the context of today's post, I might actually use his tears as an indication of suffering even over the crucifixion. That is, I don't know whether he suffered bodily in any sense that I could even begin to understand on the cross, but the only reason he (who knows <i>precisely</i> what death is) should cry over Lazarus is because he was genuinely saddened by the event. That loss of an intersubjective relationship hurt him, just as much as anyone was ever hurt by the loss of a loved one.<br /><br />So yes, I think he suffers.juliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15975754287030568726noreply@blogger.com