tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post7366330779332861547..comments2024-03-28T20:04:20.286-07:00Comments on One Cʘsmos: Beaming Down from Dreamland without a Transporter AccidentGagdad Bobhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comBlogger47125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-40867123006132467272010-12-02T10:53:46.590-08:002010-12-02T10:53:46.590-08:00(cont)
At the risk of falling on my own fallacies,...(cont)<br />At the risk of falling on my own fallacies, they fail in a similar way to how current lifespan models fail in telling you about your own life. The<br /><br /> <i>"If you were born to middle class parents, cancer free on both sides, mild alcoholism on one side, and parents didn't divorce, you can expect to live until X years, have n kids, and expect a Y% probability of remaining married yourself."</i><br /><br />While statistically that may hold across a large enough sampling of individuals, it tells you exactly zero about any particular individual. And unless you have a large enough statistical sampling, then reliable statistics couldn't even be drawn... and unless you've got a stash of civilizations somewhere from which to draw from, I don't think there have been enough to make reliable forecasts from... and again, when you get down to looking at one particular civilization, it would tell you exactly zero about it.<br /><br />Spengler has many interesting things to say, but his fundamentals relegates them to being isolated particulars, not all that different from the twice a day accuracy of the stopped clock (yeah, that's a little unfair, but not wrong). Kant said lots of swell sounding things too, even sounds like he supports individuality and freedom, but his fundamentals negates them all across the board.<br /><br />"However, some of what he says rings true. Civilizations and cultures have some rules."<br /><br />They have certain traits, yes, and like I said, some basic rules and laws can be applied, and must be followed to be successful - and the models hold best when all those basic rules are broken - but they can tell you very little about real expectations or predictions. Many cultures and civilizations have seemed to followed the same traits, but when you really dig in to the details, I think you'll find they were mostly cherry picked to fit the format. And those that seem to fit, seem to fit from <i>this</i> end of history, looking at the past; were they still active, any one of the predictions could each have been blown to bits by just one instance of the unexpected. <br /><br />Cultural and civilizational models provide no possible way to foresee the actions of a few committed people at the right time and place, any one of which could thoroughly futz up the predictions and mix up the colors. <br /><br />Western Civilization itself never would have been at all, except for a few vocal individuals (and a culture which made it possible to listen to them) in Athens and Sparta, absent them, Persia would probably not even have a notation for them in their history books. No model could, or does, enable that observation or forecast.<br /><br />And because a few people in England didn't sit down and shut up, and because the printing press had been invented, ideas such as what John Locke typified, altered the course of England which should have been settling back into a nice totalitarian decline under King James; the freedoms of the Magna Carta had been corrupted and spent, and that should have been that. But because there were people who spoke up, others who listened, and even more who acted, England had their "Glorious Revolution", and despite what Beck and everyone else bewails daily about "Freedom once lost, can never be regained"... they did lose it, and they did regain it, and without even a violent revolution. And because they did that, America came into full being, none of which should or could have been predicted by any of the models.<br /><br />Yes, very generally, they can seem to apply, but in actuality, no, they do not, when these models are right... they only happen to be.<br /><br />If you like the theories, enjoy, they are interesting and can take your thoughts in many worthwhile directions... but I think they're a crock,... maybe you can get back to me in a few hundred years and prove me wrong.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-61258458257472350082010-12-02T10:53:15.379-08:002010-12-02T10:53:15.379-08:00JP Said "In the realm of economics, you can o...JP Said "In the realm of economics, you can only expand an economy so quickly, due to human nature."<br /><br />What would have qualified as 'only so quickly' would have been a very different speed in 1500 and even 1800, than it would have been clocked at just a few decades later. There would have been a few recalibrations needed in 1900, 1960, 1975, and 1980 & 1988 as well.<br /><br />"In the realm of physics, we are now to the point where we are close to figuring out the boundary conditions for the physical world. This is the "Theory of Everything". It's simply the outer limits of what is possible in this universe."<br /><br />Some people think so, others don't. But even if so, it has zero application to an individual human life, let alone a culture.<br /><br />"For instance, in case you haven't noticed, people live a fixed amount of time and are defined by their personalities (unless severe mind parasites, developmental problems, ect.). Cultures and civilizations operate on similar rules."<br /><br />Sorry no, what's true for individuals isn't true for cultures and civilizations, lots of little things like fallacy of composition, and others, torpedoes’ that right off the bat. What applies to a person, cannot be said to apply to a civilization in any way other than happenstancial similarities - somewhat correlative, but in no way causal. Socrates made a similar goof in his attempt to define Justice from the top down in the Republic. And Top Down just doesn't work in a complex system, especially one where you've got to factor in that every path taken from the top down, can take an infinite number of different branch paths, each of which will trigger an infinite number of additional paths, etc.<br /><br />You might say "Good in theory, but not in practice", but really, only a certain amount of tunnel vision can make it sound like it's good theory. Looks neat on paper, doesn't work at all.<br /><br />Analagies are excellent tools, they help us grasp things and develop new ideas, but treating them as more than what they are, can be a dicey, even a dangerous, business.<br /><br />"I'm not talking about control, I'm talking about boundary conditions and lifespan."<br /><br />Of course the models don't seek to control civilization (though some people do seek to use them in order to do just that), but they do seek to follow the same deterministic methodologies in making their assumptions. <br /><br />JP, I do get what you're talking about, I subscribed to them for a while myself, but after looking into it, no, they just don't hold up - IMHO. <br />(sigh... break)Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-35818886627730072832010-12-02T08:04:10.903-08:002010-12-02T08:04:10.903-08:00In the realm of physics, we are now to the point w...<i>In the realm of physics, we are now to the point where we are close to figuring out the boundary conditions for the physical world. This is the "Theory of Everything". It's simply the outer limites of what is possible in this universe.</i><br /><br />At least, they keep <i>thinking</i> we're getting closer. Then <a href="http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/nation/stories/DN-stars_02nat.ART.State.Edition1.c609b6.html" rel="nofollow">something surprising</a> usually happens...juliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15975754287030568726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-32045852946985947282010-12-02T06:14:50.808-08:002010-12-02T06:14:50.808-08:00Van says:
"If it is impossible to define, re...Van says:<br /><br />"If it is impossible to define, regulate and control a 'free' market economy, or even one industry within it, and that is nuttier than a fruitcake, how much more insane and hubristic must it be to claim to do so for an entire civilization?"<br /><br />I'm not talking about control, I'm talking about boundary conditions and lifespan.<br /><br />For instance, in case you haven't noticed, people live a fixed amount of time and are defined by their personalities (unless severe mind parasites, developmental problems, ect.). Cultures and civilizations operate on similar rules. I'm applying the Rule of Analogy from MOT here.<br /><br />In the realm of economics, you can only expand an economy so quickly, due to human nature.<br /><br />In the realm of physics, we are now to the point where we are close to figuring out the boundary conditions for the physical world. This is the "Theory of Everything". It's simply the outer limites of what is possible in this universe.<br /><br />I don't want the "determinism" aspect of civlizational theory; I want the boundary conditions.<br /><br />I don't look at cilizational theory for determinism; I look at it for outer limits and general broad brush strokes.<br /><br />A lot of Spengler is wrong. For instance, he called architecture frozen math. Architecture is frozen music. <br /><br />However, some of what he says rings true. Civilizations and cultures have some rules.JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-39441355620873752072010-12-02T00:28:15.278-08:002010-12-02T00:28:15.278-08:00Since the spirit of prophecy is now freely availab...Since the spirit of prophecy is now freely available for download, so to say, writing down all prophecies in one book would be impossible.Magnus Itlandhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/18445902788427523461noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-38225897722401275352010-12-01T21:02:11.679-08:002010-12-01T21:02:11.679-08:00Wait a minute... what flows through an open trench...Wait a minute... what flows through an open trench again?<br /><br />Between baby daughter and raw capitalism (that smell, that boardroom smell, I <i>love</i> the smell of a mezzanine round in the morning...) I'm barely keeping up with posts here, but this one really rocks.<br /><br />I mean, <a href="http://www.slate.com/id/2275645/pagenum/all/" rel="nofollow">read here</a> what the mainstream smartypants set babble about when they discuss the nature of consciousness (sample: "some scientists insist it doesn't exist"). Are we lucky to have OC, or what?Stephen Macdonaldhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13474300559219020772noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-44702469231282607622010-12-01T15:51:47.184-08:002010-12-01T15:51:47.184-08:00GovernMENTAL Sanity rears its non-hockey stick-sha...GovernMENTAL Sanity rears its non-hockey stick-shaped <a href="http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-12-01/pelosi-s-climate-change-panel-will-become-casualty-of-republican-takeover.html" rel="nofollow">head!</a>gehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02015936407999495181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-26595443387736964122010-12-01T15:35:36.750-08:002010-12-01T15:35:36.750-08:00(cont)
Not all that much different than economics...(cont)<br /><br />Not all that much different than economics either. There are some basic rules which can, should and must be grasped for an economy to flourish, but having done so doesn't convey the ability to fine tune, or even accurately predict future behavior. Most of economics, aside from the fundamentals are a crock, and even given a society run by the correct principles rather than by con game we operate on, even given that, economists who claim to be able to control or predict anything other than in broad-brush, are frauds and hucksters (the exception being when you see that a people are violating a fundamental rule, it's valid and not all that difficult to predict disappointment and even ruin from violating those rules - the bailouts come to mind - but other than that, to make positive pronouncements, nah. Poop.<br /><br />What drives history is people, and what drives people is philosophy (abstract and religious) and of course their laws and interactions which are inseparable from the gazillion choices each of those people will be making from one instant to another , and how that all plays out depends on their willingness to face reality, and the near infinite number of possibilities which can result from that - they do not, and cannot, fit into or abide by or be driven by or even explained by, any deterministic controls or comprehensive predictions.<br /><br />If it is impossible to define, regulate and control a 'free' market economy, or even one industry within it, and <i>that is</i> nuttier than a fruitcake, how much more insane and hubristic must it be to claim to do so for an entire civilization?Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-69217163452586024882010-12-01T15:35:04.557-08:002010-12-01T15:35:04.557-08:00JP... I always seem to be in opposition to you ove...JP... I always seem to be in opposition to you over one thing or another... sorry about that... I'll buy the first round if we ever find a nice bar to meet up over. Ok then... here we go...<br /><br />"If you have a better civilizational theory, I'm all ears."<br /><br />No, I don't, and I think they are, one and all, over reaching, simplistic, and whether they be adorned with claims of grand myths, or color coded to make it easier to impress your friends with McWisdom tagging... they are far more comforting to the theorizer, than substantial and useful in their explanations, past, present or future.<br /><br />Victor Davis Hanson had a comment once which I thought was spot on regarding Spengler... here it is,<br /><i>Question: What history books would you recommend to enable me to get a good overview of world history?<br /><br />Hanson: I read those I don’t like—Hegel, Spengler, and Toynbee to learn about, and thus to avoid, the pitfalls of determinism, and then those I do that are empirical: Thucydides, Tacitus, Gibbon, Prescott, Churchill, and modern counterparts like Alistair Horne, Martin Gilbert, John Keegan, Hugh Thomas, Donald Kagan, Steven Ozment.</i><br /><br />I'm not a fan of determinism in any of it's costumes, and dressing it up in grand myth's to give it omniscient abilities, I no longer see as anything other than the cheapest and gaudiest of getup's.<br /><br />Those who claim to have found a 'civilizational model' which civilizations not only predictably go through but claim to be able to see that one is now on schedule to click over into their next phase... sorry, but they're bogus. Yes in a very broad brush way, civilizations have particular traits in youth, they change as they mature, and change again as they die and new ones come along.<br /><br />Wow. How incisive.<br /><br />Spengler (going on memory here) makes all sorts of comparisons between the Roman's and Americans, but most of them are fairly surface level, shallow, claims that don't hold up under scrutiny, and certainly flop as predictors of what comes next. I think Spengler himself... didn't he move on towards the end of his life, from worrying about the looming coincidences of Roman bogeymen to environmental and technological ones? I could be wrong there... I'd have to dig out my old papers... and I really don't want to.<br /><br />You know what one of the most popular book subjects was in Rome at about 120B.C.? The imminent fall of Rome. They were backed up by analysis's of all the best Greek & Roman thinkers, Hesiod, Plato, etc, theories of Gold, Silver, Bronze and Iron ages and all the indicators told them all that the jig was up... any dei now, it'd all fall down. The Roman Republic lasted another 100 years, the Empire continued on in Rome another 400 after that, and the Roman Empire continued on in its eastern seat at Constantinople for, what, another 1,200 years after that? So... no... I don't put a lot of stock in the gloom and doomers, let alone those who claim they can make accurate predictions for them, or give us comprehensive models 'explaining' them.<br />(argh... break)Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-73609098467504922162010-12-01T15:14:48.064-08:002010-12-01T15:14:48.064-08:00To: Open Trench
Re: blackhole
Does this mean you ...To: Open Trench<br />Re: blackhole<br /><br />Does this mean you are over Soundgarden?Tigtoghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03290914498892961024noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-7216532250500829472010-12-01T15:06:55.713-08:002010-12-01T15:06:55.713-08:00Bon Chance (“good courage”),
Open Trench!
a toast...Bon Chance (“good courage”), <br />Open Trench!<br />a <a href="http://www.anncoulter.com/" rel="nofollow">toast</a> to your<br />'new wave'gehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02015936407999495181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-80678499220525806902010-12-01T14:45:09.102-08:002010-12-01T14:45:09.102-08:00Open Trench:
Hurray! We are all shovel ready at t...Open Trench:<br /><br />Hurray! We are all shovel ready at the news of your recent coonversion. :^)USS Ben USN (Ret)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07492369604790651538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-72256772033574237572010-12-01T14:43:56.780-08:002010-12-01T14:43:56.780-08:00Hi Walt!
Ha ha! Well, I do do a form of whododood...Hi Walt!<br /><br />Ha ha! Well, I do do a form of whododoodoofu, which involves entirely TMIfu...USS Ben USN (Ret)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07492369604790651538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-51698556824436388282010-12-01T14:33:39.188-08:002010-12-01T14:33:39.188-08:00I believe I will abandon leftism as of now. It ju...I believe I will abandon leftism as of now. It just doesn't feel right anymore for me. It kind of sickens me. The students here are not being educated well. <br /><br />I now take up Racoonism as my orientation. For some reason it now seems emminently reasonable. Go figure.<br /><br />I'll have to keep up appearances at the office or I'll get canned tho. They'll find some reason.<br /><br />I know how to act like a leftist from long experience so I probably won't get sussed out.<br /><br />I don't want the Black Hole moniker anymore. My new name is Open Trench.black holehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07366633817665791528noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-55835993874142002372010-12-01T14:24:03.703-08:002010-12-01T14:24:03.703-08:00Ben -
You know I'm always interested in thing...Ben -<br /><br />You know I'm always interested in things ending in "-fu." But I've learned the hard way that it's important to learn from an expert.<br /><br />So, maybe you could help? I mean, do you do doodoo-fu?walthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01388218390016612051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-18198050562110153982010-12-01T14:21:38.983-08:002010-12-01T14:21:38.983-08:00Well to answer to Tig Tog regarding a lack of rece...Well to answer to Tig Tog regarding a lack of recent prophesy:<br /><br />You can make your own prophecies. Just relax and use the Force, so to speak.<br /><br />My Prophecies:<br /><br />AI by 3000<br /><br />Demise of Leftism by 3300<br /><br />Rise of Gnostic Civilization c. 3500<br /><br />Diaspora to other worlds by 4000<br /><br />Partial Divininisation of Humanity c. 300000 A.D.<br /><br />Complete conversion of the body to pure energy format c.500000 A.D.<br /><br />Complete Divinisation of all life, matter and energy in the Cosmos. End of Game 10,000,000,000 A.D.<br /><br />Also I would add that prophecies are not very useful. Think of the ones in the bible or from the past. What have they done for you lately? <br /><br />For me,Squatoosh.Open Trenchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06354412002318534131noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-14648785920603156392010-12-01T14:07:05.243-08:002010-12-01T14:07:05.243-08:00Van says:
"No, not being a Spenglarian, I...Van says:<br /><br />"No, not being a Spenglarian, I'm using them as I'm using them (more Poetic than Mythic, and there is a big difference... but it still doesn't come out right without a looong post, so don't provoke me... for all of our sakes), please don't put Spengler's myths in my mouth, it's unsanitary."<br /><br />If you have a better civilizational theory, I'm all ears.JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-25763100969909993312010-12-01T13:48:54.300-08:002010-12-01T13:48:54.300-08:00Van:
Trackfu can also be used in coonjunction wit...Van:<br /><br />Trackfu can also be used in coonjunction with huntfu. There's also the sub-sub specialty of doofu (aka doodoofu) which also aids in trackfu/huntfu. :^)USS Ben USN (Ret)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07492369604790651538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-87185863037314808722010-12-01T13:42:10.014-08:002010-12-01T13:42:10.014-08:00This is why one is sometimes tempted, as is Rush L...This is why one is sometimes tempted, as is Rush Limbaugh, to think that the damage inflected by the left must be intentional. I don't generally believe this. Rather, I believe that the majority of leftists have good intentions, but are honestly blind to their self-defeating ideas."<br /><br />I also generally believe this. Van mentioned this, however, it's still difficult to understand the follow-up deniability that leftists brandish as a form of crucifix when their ideas result in the deaths of thousands and even millions of people (DDT, Vietnam, Cuba, Soviet Union, China, etc.). <br /><br />Not to mention the massive economical damage their policies cause. <br />Then there's the destruction of family, tradition, honor, language, music, education, history...I mean, pretty much everything that is Good, True and Beautiful is targetted and attacked by leftism.<br /><br />And yet...rarely, very rarely does any leftist feel guilty for causing this (let alone admit it), their good intentions be (are) damned.<br /><br />I reckon that's no real surprise, considering they essentially deny (yea, attack!) reality, but it doesn't elicit much sympathy neither.<br />My pity meter seems to be broken irt leftists.<br /><br />That bein' said, I heartily welcome any leftists that do see the error and destruction of that ideology and choose to embrace reality (truth).USS Ben USN (Ret)https://www.blogger.com/profile/07492369604790651538noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-33028809586776924342010-12-01T13:23:58.558-08:002010-12-01T13:23:58.558-08:00JP said "Prophesies, as Van is using them are...JP said "Prophesies, as Van is using them are a "myth of the Grand Style"<br /><br />No, not being a Spenglarian, I'm using them as I'm using them (more Poetic than Mythic, and there is a big difference... but it still doesn't come out right without a looong post, so don't provoke me... for all of our sakes), please don't put Spengler's myths in my mouth, it's unsanitary.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-11591343588169899232010-12-01T13:11:31.116-08:002010-12-01T13:11:31.116-08:00Tigtog says:
"The reason for my questioning ...Tigtog says:<br /><br />"The reason for my questioning is that through my readings of the last year or so, I have come to conclusion that all the prophecy within the Bible is of Zoroastrian pedigree (e.g., heaven, hell, Messiah, satan, angels, resurrection, and apocalyptic battle between good/evil - light/darkness)."<br /><br />These were the sources for Orthodox Civilization. That ended. The last parabolic blowoff was the Ottoman Empire. We are now dealing with the residual shards of it in the form of the Muslims.<br /><br /><br />We then got the West, starting somewhere between 800 and 1000 A.D. That is in the process of ending. It will take a few centuries or so.<br /><br />Russia (Orthodox Civilization II) is still functional. I'm not sure what will become of it, but it's not exaclty dead. The West looks to infinite space. Russia looks to the infinite horizon (fractally speaking).<br /><br />I don't know what will replace the West. Western Civilization II? But it will require, in the Words of Oswald Spengler is the "Birth of a myth of the Grand Style expressing a New God-feeling. World-fear. World Longing"<br /><br />Van notes:<br /><br />"On the literal level, why have no new prophesies been written, I think first answer holds - until the old ones are used up for a civilization (and that may involve and require the ending of that civilization), no new ones are needed or possible."<br /><br />Prophesies, as Van is using them are a "myth of the Grand Style".<br /><br />New myths are being generated now, I'm certain.<br /><br />You will get your new holy books. It's only a matter of time.JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-38848538493645604552010-12-01T12:42:18.923-08:002010-12-01T12:42:18.923-08:00as is my spellingas is my spellingmushroomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07651027035577798096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-28457623008220998702010-12-01T12:41:30.553-08:002010-12-01T12:41:30.553-08:00"What God remembers is" -- George MacDon..."What God remembers is" -- George MacDonald<br /><br /><i>Or to use a computer analogy, you're a little "buggy."</i> <br /><br />Your image exutable is slightly corrupted.<br /><br /><br /><i>this pathological dance of losers</i><br /><br />Monty Python missed an opportunity for a great skit.mushroomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07651027035577798096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-22825998869443845732010-12-01T12:17:12.741-08:002010-12-01T12:17:12.741-08:00Tigtog said "The reason for my questioning is...Tigtog said "The reason for my questioning is that through my readings of the last year or so, I have come to conclusion that all the prophecy within the Bible is of Zoroastrian pedigree (e.g., heaven, hell, Messiah, satan, angels, resurrection, and apocalyptic battle between good/evil - light/darkness). These concepts came to us through Babylon via the Jewish Exile (see Jewish Prophets). This makes these prophecies much older than their introduction within the Old Testament. (This ain't Moses's Yahweh anymore). So when I ask why there are no new prophecies within the Christian tradition, I am being serious. Has all Divine truth been conveyed? "<br /><br />Ah. I wasn't quite following where you were pointing, was I. But... then again, I kinda was too.<br /><br />On the literal level, why have no new prophesies been written, I think first answer holds - until the old ones are used up for a civilization (and that may involve and require the ending of that civilization), no new ones are needed or possible.<br /><br />On the next level... how about what else Babylon gave us, like the startings of numbering and geometry. <br />Numbers, numbering haven't really changed from their day to ours, though they used different symbols and notations, etc... but the potential inherent in their system of numbering had and has been there all along.<br /><br />Because they used a different symbol for one, doesn't mean that our 1 doesn't refer to the same... and because they didn't know about zero, doesn't mean that the possibility of it wasn't there all along. The deeper development of calculation, geometry, algebra, calculus... same 10 digits, same 360 degrees, the only thing that's changed has come from how deeply we've learned to dig into them, calculate and reveal ever deeper layers and possibilities in them.<br /><br />I don't think the stories changed at all since the first cave paintings... we've just learned to depict and clarify the stories, and their reflections (prophesies), as our depth perception has improved.<br /><br />The song itself, I think it remains the same.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-36088797628539868622010-12-01T12:16:36.150-08:002010-12-01T12:16:36.150-08:00Former pro hoopster Charles Barkley is known for s...<i>Former pro hoopster Charles Barkley is known for speaking his mind, and he didn't hold back Tuesday night when discussing President Barack Obama's basketball abilities on "Conan."<br /><br />"I'm an old fat guy now, but I'll kick his ass," said Barkley, suggesting that he could beat the president in a one-on-one.<br /><br />Obama's biggest problem? "He's a lefty. He always goes left. And if you just stand there, I'm not sure if you were to open up the right side, he could go right at all."</i><br /><br />'nuff saidgehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02015936407999495181noreply@blogger.com