tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post7259333930926906134..comments2024-03-27T11:16:36.951-07:00Comments on One Cʘsmos: Whittle While I WorkGagdad Bobhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comBlogger61125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-88903697027344126322012-12-03T22:01:41.472-08:002012-12-03T22:01:41.472-08:00JP said "What is this great chain of being th...JP said "What is this great chain of being thingy?"<br /><br />A bit <a href="http://faculty.up.edu/asarnow/GreatChainofBeing.htm" rel="nofollow">cheesed up, but it is from wackademia:</a><br /><br />"Among the most important of the continuities with the Classical period was the concept of the Great Chain of Being. Its major premise was that every existing thing in the universe had its "place" in a divinely planned hierarchical order, which was pictured as a chain vertically extended. ("Hierarchical" refers to an order based on a series of higher and lower, strictly ranked gradations.) An object's "place" depended on the relative proportion of "spirit" and "matter" it contained--the less "spirit" and the more "matter," the lower down it stood."<br /><br />Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-56968792141909960922012-12-03T10:03:40.299-08:002012-12-03T10:03:40.299-08:00JP said " I don't argue with people about...JP said " I don't argue with people about politics/religion/Van because it tends to alienate them."<br /><br />On the contrary, I think you don't argue because you you assume you are already alienated from them and would rather leave it that way, hoping to avoid being found out (which was why that despicable dictum was sold as ' manners' in the first place).<br /><br />See Magister's comment above.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-58656336847717996522012-12-03T09:56:24.327-08:002012-12-03T09:56:24.327-08:00Magister, Yep. And especially on: " They'...Magister, Yep. And especially on: " They're screwing my kids, and that means I don't have to play nice."Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-19486442206903116682012-12-03T08:27:54.789-08:002012-12-03T08:27:54.789-08:00"College" is a major part of this probl..."College" is a major part of this problem. Baccalaureate institutions prolong adolescence and chain students to the state's "largesse."<br /><br />Once you throw students to the wolves of the marketplace, they grow up fast. They hustle. They innovate and scratch itches. And they don't like you messing with their money. Then they also get involved in the charities they want, in a big way.<br /><br />The Statists were very patient in their long march. So too must be the Freemen. Here are three points in what must be a relentless critique:<br /><br />1. The State is the Dead Hand of economic life. Exhibit A: Europe.<br /><br />2. Relativists are the socialites of the intellectual world.<br /><br />3. When Democrats are in charge, you get Detroit.<br /><br />The next twenty years are going to be rough, folks. <br /><br />I used to be a quiet, polite guy about politics. It got my kids eight years of Obama.<br /><br />Now when people ask, I'm blunt. Example: "Great news about Obama, eh?" "No, actually. He's a proven disaster, for everyone." You should see the looks on their faces. I used to care, but now I don't.<br /><br />They're screwing my kids, and that means I don't have to play nice.Tonyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00987042455512485699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-45317339634310954502012-12-03T06:49:06.606-08:002012-12-03T06:49:06.606-08:00vile nytimes reports on the vagaries of fame, char...vile nytimes reports on the vagaries of fame, charity, doing 'good' out of <br /><a href="http://www.nytimes.com/2012/12/03/nyregion/barefoot-homeless-man-says-hes-grateful-for-boots.html?_r=0" rel="nofollow">context</a>gehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02015936407999495181noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-72385924378824105832012-12-02T20:16:35.760-08:002012-12-02T20:16:35.760-08:00I kind of missed the liberal secular humanism bus....I kind of missed the liberal secular humanism bus.<br /><br />That is to say, it left without me on it in the first place. Granted, I was on the materialist bus, but that's because science came so easily to me. I chucked that in college.<br /><br />I don't argue with people about politics/religion/Van because it tends to alienate them. <br /><br />What is this great chain of being thingy?<br />JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-25182253063832827392012-12-02T19:54:15.828-08:002012-12-02T19:54:15.828-08:00Van,
Yes, it was Western Civ Part 2. The teacher ...Van,<br /><br />Yes, it was Western Civ Part 2. The teacher was Robert Bucholz. An excellent lecturer- I enjoyed the course. But, as I stated, the theme that he kept referring back to was the collapse of the great chain of being (big smiles). I would be highly surprised to discover that Bucholz is not a liberal. With Noble, I am not so sure.<br /><br />I'm gonna check out the Modern Scholar series. Thanx!Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04865413665629644313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-39100574222138847472012-12-02T19:04:37.789-08:002012-12-02T19:04:37.789-08:00Mushroom said "Philmon is from MO? I'm su...Mushroom said "Philmon is from MO? I'm surprised. He seems so normal."<br /><br />Nice.<br /><br />;-)Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-84436257890670046562012-12-02T19:02:54.545-08:002012-12-02T19:02:54.545-08:00Chris said "The program started with the Renn...Chris said "The program started with the Rennaissance at which point we're told that this marked the beginning of the "collapse" of the Great Chain of Being."<br /><br />Is that "Foundations of Western Civilization"? But part 2, right? If so, in fairness, the first Prof does spend 48 lectures leading up to that point, but still, you're right, that is often the tone. <br /><br />I popped in the first few lectures of Part 1 (never got part 2) while toodling around today, to refresh my memory, and it was about what I remembered. Typically the prof affects a breezy style, heavily inflected with wry tones, always shooting for an amused detachment, slightly mocking, and for those issues which the people of the time (could be the Hebrews, could be the Sumerians) held to be important, he adds in just a dash of condescension sprinkled so as to include you, the listener, in on the joke at their expense 'Sargon, the Assyrian leader, was supposed to have been found floating in a reed basket in the river, just like the later story of Moses. Perhaps not surprisingly, a River people commonly tell stories of gifts born on the waters, as well as of disastrous floods.'<br /><br />Always the point seems to be a mechanistic, reductionist ('probably this led to that, which was then told in epic as...'), always analyzing and rarely synthesizing to anything more than a happenstance of events. Usually quick to point out the error of reading too much in to what so & so people actually accomplished, yet oblivious to their own assumptions. A couple stand out favorites from today, he goes to great lengths to disabuse the listener of their uncritical assumptions about the terms 'Foundation', 'Western' and 'Civilization', and yet in describing them he notes that Western Civ has 'produced great wealth, though often unfairly distributed', giving zero attention to what assumptions might be made in regards to 'fair' or to 'distributed'. <br /><br />And then, in describing the region the Hebrews settled and established kingdoms in, as "Roughly what we think of today as Israel, or, from another point of view, Palestine." [blink]. 'award-winning scholar and teacher Thomas F. X. Noble of the University of Notre Dame'. K.<br /><br />BTW, for several years I gobbled up huge chunks of their lecture series, but got tired of the never ending "New INCREDIBLE Sale! 75% off!", and their chopping the lectures down from 60 min to 45 min, and then down to 30 min length. I switched to the "Modern Scholar" series which are on the one hand essentially free in my monthly Audible.com subscription, and two, go to greater depth and length on their topics,& without forcing them into a set time. Still though, with a few exceptions, that tone is the norm, and if you sit through the video taped courses from MIT, Berkeley, Yale, etc, that is the least abrasive aspect of them.<br /><br />I still enjoy them all more than listening to the radio, but....Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-88462967738704485602012-12-02T18:11:26.614-08:002012-12-02T18:11:26.614-08:00Philmon is from MO? I'm surprised. He seems ...Philmon is from MO? I'm surprised. He seems so normal.mushroomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07651027035577798096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-52211231240190204952012-12-02T15:48:17.976-08:002012-12-02T15:48:17.976-08:00"Apologies for always going off topic."
..."Apologies for always going off topic."<br /><br />There's a topic?<br /><br />No wonder I always felt like I was missing something that other people seemed to intuitively know when I commented here.JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-26598429789864794462012-12-02T15:06:50.169-08:002012-12-02T15:06:50.169-08:00" One of the local high schools "locked ..." One of the local high schools "locked down" and did a drug sweep using folks from the private prison in the area. I hadn't heard of it. His friend commented that such abuse happens because of the privatization of police and jails. I told him, that I am so far removed from institutionalization (I took my children out of school 13 years ago), that I hadn't heard of it, but I wasn't surprised. The fact that such a horrible thing is happening in school and was brought on by the policies of the left, is completely lost on him."<br /><br />My father, a former school superintendent, would have loved something like this.<br /><br />He was big on the entire law and order/punishment thing. Pretty much an anti-hippy.<br /><br />His heyday was really the 1970's, when he was in charge of discipline at a high school, where he got to interrogate students and get trick them into giving up information on other misbehaving students.<br /><br />I think what he really wanted to do was be an FBI agent or Secret Service Agent. He would probably have also enjoyed being in charge of security at a U.S. embassy.<br /><br />I accompanied him on a police raid once, where a bunch of kids playing with a ball at 2am were all forced to lay down at gunpoint for violation of school property laws. This was years ago.<br /><br />I think using the police against the student population gave him an adrenalin and endorphin rush. JPhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11126071014909954387noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-3865321917986391052012-12-02T11:55:35.767-08:002012-12-02T11:55:35.767-08:00Looking forward to this new bio of Coolidge. Very...Looking forward to this new bio of <a href="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0061967556/ref=s9_newr_gw_d0_g14_ir02?pf_rd_m=ATVPDKIKX0DER&pf_rd_s=center-7&pf_rd_r=0FHSTX962QESYNJQ9JFT&pf_rd_t=101&pf_rd_p=470939291&pf_rd_i=507846" rel="nofollow">Coolidge</a>. Very much the anti-Obama.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-26126398542981186172012-12-02T11:53:45.713-08:002012-12-02T11:53:45.713-08:00Yes, relativism and collectivism sum it up nicely....Yes, relativism and collectivism sum it up nicely. Those two devolve to nihilism and tyranny, i.e., the absence of truth and freedom (which are two sides of the same coin).Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-29692690187753012672012-12-02T11:40:35.268-08:002012-12-02T11:40:35.268-08:00Apologies for always going off topic.Apologies for always going off topic.Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04865413665629644313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-10424383487195784812012-12-02T11:38:24.147-08:002012-12-02T11:38:24.147-08:00The essence of the Left is collectivism and relati...The essence of the Left is collectivism and relativism. For many years, I had a lefty-esque orientation because liberalism <i>appeared</i> to me like Tradition. But......I didn't realize that secularism is basically the 2nd commandment without the 1st. Consequently, it is a parody of Tradition. A sacred civilization is "collectivist" and "humamist"- but based upon the <i>verticality</i> of the great chain of being. <br /><br />But the masses are familiar with a very different story. I was recently watching a "History of Western Civilization" DVD from the Great Courses Company. The program started with the Rennaissance at which point we're told that this marked the beginning of the "collapse" of the Great Chain of Being. This was presented, of course, as a wonderful and enlightening thing because the GCOB provided the worldview rationale for the hierarchical feudal structure of Christendom.<br /><br /> The instructor explained that this "collapse" was a great advancement for humanity in that it laid the foundation for democracy and individual rights. The key point was clearly that God belief and the accompanying Tradition legitimized inequality and, by extension, tyranny. The perspective throughout the next few episodes was that theism equals despotism. <br /><br />Thoughts?Chrishttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04865413665629644313noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-56848570940474910792012-12-02T10:48:03.149-08:002012-12-02T10:48:03.149-08:00And the problem is not just with the GOP, but with...And the problem is not just with the GOP, but with libertarians, independents and just plain Americans in general. <br /><br />I went to a meeting at our state capitol yesterday, of grassroots activists from around our state, MO, and there was very little consistency of 'messaging' (the new buzzword) there either, though there was much concern of how to craft your messaging so as to appeal to the young, the mex... hisp... ullLahteeeenOHhhesss... etc.<br /><br />I put in my two cents, that it's not a matter of making a message more timely, but more timeless. That you can't appeal to people by 'reaching out' to them, when those you're competing with are reaching out with goodies. They have to be made to understand your message and why it is important to their lives, or fuhgedaboudit.<br /><br />I met one of our occasional OC commenters there, Philmon, and he summed it up well:<br /><br />".... many people don't really have a consistent philosophy behind what they believe ... in other words, they might believe the right things, but they don't know why. Which is kind of the job of culture. We can't all be intellectuals. Some of us got jobs."<br /><br />Definitely. Which is why culture, and respect for it, is so important (and why the left has been attacking it for so long) - it conveys the best understanding of the best of those the culture has produced, without every person having to do the due diligence of understanding every point themselves.<br /><br />Once the culture is fragmented, mocked and/or in many places simply gone - what it once had to say is no longer enough to be referenced in an argument, especially a political one.<br /><br />The essentials must be understood. Especially by those attempting to promote and defend them.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-34022974016957314622012-12-02T10:31:39.571-08:002012-12-02T10:31:39.571-08:00Awesome. And 15 minutes or no, he does nail the co...Awesome. And 15 minutes or no, he does nail the core problem, that being that those the GOP (and others) put forward, either do not actually believe the ideas they claim to represent, or they are incapable of articulating them, and do not have the spine to do so even if they could.<br /><br />Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-66155002771192093352012-12-01T20:09:42.009-08:002012-12-01T20:09:42.009-08:00Completely off topic, speaking of strange things t...Completely off topic, speaking of strange things that happen to people after they move, tonight I'm being treated to the sound of a mariachi band, live from my next-door neighbor's back yard. Sounds like quite the party...juliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15975754287030568726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-75081152206013382282012-12-01T18:22:06.322-08:002012-12-01T18:22:06.322-08:00I don't like Glen Beck either, but nor was I e...I don't like Glen Beck either, but nor was I ever a big Buckley fan.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-14244980619767990272012-12-01T17:10:28.584-08:002012-12-01T17:10:28.584-08:00GB scares the shit out of me.
I can't compete...GB scares the shit out of me.<br /><br />I can't compete with his mind, knowledge, experience, or wisdom, and know my comeuppance is more than do.<br /><br />So I will say it: The GOP needs more Buckley.<br /><br />We need to go back in time.<br /><br />Everyone that truly cares must be willing to prove it by quoting Buckley accurately where, and most importantly <i>when</i> as Buckley knew timing is everything, things D. Carnegie talked about in How to Win Friends ... namely, be like dog: loyal, enthusiastic, and game.<br /><br />I don't supplicate much GB and don't want to confront everything you stand for as I am sitting staring at mystic Buckley metaphors and that satisfies me (like C. Kane told his wife Susan).<br /><br />https://cumulus.hillsdale.edu/Buckley/<br /><br />Guildofcannonballshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10352588747567045751noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-19083076447730074512012-12-01T16:32:16.699-08:002012-12-01T16:32:16.699-08:00We have some liberal friends who moved to Bend, Or...We have some liberal friends who moved to Bend, Oregon, and thought the schools were so bad, they founded their own private school. But I don't think it ever occurred to them to ask why public schools are so bad, and who is responsible. Just clueless.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-23513134039995132172012-12-01T16:12:06.684-08:002012-12-01T16:12:06.684-08:00I have a liberal friend, "Lance", who of...I have a liberal friend, "Lance", who often posts things to see what I will say. Today, he posted an article about something that happened in my town. One of the local high schools "locked down" and did a drug sweep using folks from the private prison in the area. I hadn't heard of it. His friend commented that such abuse happens because of the privatization of police and jails. I told him, that I am so far removed from institutionalization (I took my children out of school 13 years ago), that I hadn't heard of it, but I wasn't surprised. The fact that such a horrible thing is happening in school and was brought on by the policies of the left, is completely lost on him. So typical of the left.Lesliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02284936021406079076noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-40344601676024113962012-12-01T12:36:37.201-08:002012-12-01T12:36:37.201-08:00The irony is that liberals are such sanctimonious,...The irony is that liberals are such sanctimonious, buzz-killing prigs and scolds, which is then projected into the conservatives of their imagination. Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-7577016199559733562012-12-01T12:31:03.394-08:002012-12-01T12:31:03.394-08:00I sometimes wonder if we ultimately distinguish be...I sometimes wonder if we ultimately distinguish between lived experience and what we have "experienced" say in watching countless movies where liberals are heroes and conservatives villains.<br /><br />Reality shows that one is successful and happy by embracing conservative values. It is entirely inescapable. Only those largely buffered from reality deeply believe otherwise. Yet simultaneously we imagine we *know* that leftism is true because we've "experienced" it being the case so many times. <br /><br />This is where <a href="http://www.city-journal.org/2012/eon1107ak.html" rel="nofollow">Andrew Klavan's</a> insistence on winning the culture through art, music, movies etc becomes imperative. Perhaps there can then be a degree of unification between one's actual lived experience and cultivated imagination.<br /><br />It has been on my mind how I could better contribute to that. <br /><br /><br />Jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06708393262849661076noreply@blogger.com