tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post4388175744462840252..comments2024-03-28T20:04:20.286-07:00Comments on One Cʘsmos: Stone Age Economics and the Religion of the Left: What Would Jesus Bankroll? (5.24.09)Gagdad Bobhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comBlogger69125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-31531852622593785532007-05-20T08:13:00.000-07:002007-05-20T08:13:00.000-07:00Ricky Raccoon said "It’s not granite."?Granite?wt_...Ricky Raccoon said "It’s not granite."<BR/><BR/>?Granite?wt_?(scrolls up)<I>"...block of granite as an impo..."</I><BR/><BR/><B>O.</B><B>M.</B><B>G.</B><BR/><BR/>(face blazes red)<BR/><BR/>er... uhmm... I posted it at 07:35:00 PM ... and 35 minus 7 is 28...(no that's good)... uhm... <I>but it was PM not AM, so it wasn't I AM speaking! And Uranus was in my 7th house... and....</I><BR/><BR/>Oh... bollocks. m a r b l e ... (how embarrassing).Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-87168835648920298652007-05-20T07:11:00.000-07:002007-05-20T07:11:00.000-07:00Van, I think we agree. Especially here when you sa...Van, I think we agree. Especially here when you said, “So yes, liberty exists in the Individual, but it takes effort towards scaling the Vertical, in order to bring it to light.”<BR/><BR/>It was something about the concept that humans are built without it didn’t seem right.<BR/><BR/>My point was the actually error was thinking they would “wish” to be free. They can’t wish for it because of mind parasites. So, really, I prefer Bob’s mind parasite theory over Gress’s.<BR/><BR/>But I do like Gress’s idea here:<BR/><BR/>“But Gress believes that such critical ideas as liberty, democracy, and the free market were not so much ideas as behaviors that people lived out and only later reflected upon, in the manner, say, of Adam Smith. In other words, no one invented capitalism, or liberty or democracy, and that's sort of the point. These things had to first be lived and experienced in order to be valued.”<BR/><BR/>I agree that freedom can’t be fully appreciated (by some people) until you’ve been denied it and then later lived it. <BR/><BR/>RE the “feminist, marxist & pomofo sites”, I can’t get past the URLs anymore.<BR/>I think my point still stands on them. They’ve never had their freedoms ripped from them.<BR/><BR/>BTW, I like the David reference.<BR/>But one small, small, tiny, tiny, nit. It’s not granite. For a few, I think, interesting reasons too, by the way. Had many discussions with my sculpture prof on this and other related concepts. He was a pretty profound guy and I am so glad I met him. One of the lucky ones to have had a couple great teachers – as you talk about in your recent posts. I hope to add a section on my site soon of the things we talked about.Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10589423819039764711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-59009957013521907482007-05-19T20:10:00.000-07:002007-05-19T20:10:00.000-07:00The NoMos are on the road again visiting family. ...The NoMos are on the road again visiting family. Only have a moment to check in with the coon den - nice cozy fire burning as usual. Very important post, Bob. <BR/><BR/>For some reason today I've been imagining life in the Garden. Everyone truly Free. No one ashamed to be running naked chasing pizza. Pure economics, pure politics, pure religion. God walking down the path in the cool of the day, just waiting to engage in conversation. Pure laughter and community. Pure coons, pure Joy. No left, no right, only Real.NoMohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01100042056270224683noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-86669931748738460812007-05-19T20:04:00.000-07:002007-05-19T20:04:00.000-07:00What other potentials lie hidden...Just got my col...What other potentials lie hidden...<BR/><BR/>Just got my collection of Shakespeare's works... its going to be thoroughly worn soon...!<BR/><BR/>wv: pxyava? That's a... tongan WV!!!!<BR/><BR/>*flees from the Blogger software!*Ephrem Antony Grayhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00032465992619034619noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-25489769330005471372007-05-19T20:03:00.000-07:002007-05-19T20:03:00.000-07:00Canary, do Tongan's like humor? Of course. Lots of...Canary, do Tongan's like humor? Of course. Lots of it. Usually medium rare, and heavily salted.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-62148216435698241052007-05-19T19:58:00.000-07:002007-05-19T19:58:00.000-07:00Susannah "Van, now you've got me reading on hoplit...Susannah "Van, now you've got me reading on hoplite warfare. I have so much to learn."<BR/><BR/>Aaaannddd lovin' it!<BR/><BR/>'The Other Greeks' and 'Carnage and Culture' are two of Hanson's books that show those connections, and what it is that he sees as being behind them. <BR/><BR/>All of his that I've read, about 7, have been very interesting and thought provoking. From a different angle, 'Who Killed Homer', which he wrote with John Heath gives a good illustration of how the education of Western Culture has been impacted by the progressives and pomofo's.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-82464851016020785432007-05-19T19:35:00.000-07:002007-05-19T19:35:00.000-07:00Ricky Racoon said "If liberty exists in us now, th...Ricky Racoon said "If liberty exists in us now, then doesn’t it mean it always existed, even if only as a potential?"<BR/><BR/>Think of it as Michangelo's David - when it was just a block of granite. If we can see the statue in a museum, wasn't the David, always there?<BR/><BR/>Yes and No. Given the assignment to sculpt a statue of David, most would turn away from the block of granite as an impossible, gritty, dirty job that wouldn't work - a pipe dream.<BR/><BR/>Some, those with vision, would see a statue within, and it may or may not have been comparable with the David. Only Michaelangelo saw the David, and brought it to light. <BR/><BR/>Now, anybody can see it, no effort needed... Yes and No. Now anyone can see the statue, but it still takes effort to see the vertical virtues embodied in the stone - to see the inspiration Michaelangelo embodied into the stone.<BR/><BR/>So yes, liberty exists in the Individual, but it takes effort towards scalling the Vertical, in order to bring it to light. It even takes effort to see it, when its right in front of your face. Check some of those feminist, marxist & pomofo sites for how much they don't see when they look at it.<BR/><BR/>And so,<BR/><BR/>“I had had it in my mind that the desire for liberty was a universal human wish, something built into us. Therefore, all you have to do is "give" it to people, and that will be that.”<BR/><BR/>No free luncheither for the belly or the spirit.Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-70016887757258603932007-05-19T19:34:00.000-07:002007-05-19T19:34:00.000-07:00Bunnies,I wonder who B'ob would figure on the post...Bunnies,<BR/><BR/>I wonder who B'ob would figure on the postmodern Grand Inquisitor. Algore? Chomsky? John Shelby Spong?vogzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04777803276210863997noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-33833781824779312082007-05-19T18:46:00.000-07:002007-05-19T18:46:00.000-07:00Beware leaving your two year old in the back yard ...Beware leaving your two year old in the back yard with the garden hose if you have a dryer vent on the back of your house and he has seen you gas up the car...joycehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11456465195258073699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-4983787929027177912007-05-19T18:31:00.000-07:002007-05-19T18:31:00.000-07:00Blue laws! Cool! I approve, although something t...Blue laws! Cool! I approve, although something tells me the gals at feministing would not.<BR/><BR/>Van, now you've got me reading on hoplite warfare. I have so much to learn.Susannahhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16381272662339466736noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-33586642025060466262007-05-19T17:56:00.000-07:002007-05-19T17:56:00.000-07:00Sorry I'm late to the pizza flavored luau...I just...Sorry I'm late to the pizza flavored luau...I just found the site.<BR/><BR/>These Tongans sound like the best thing since sliced leftists!<BR/><BR/>Thought some visitors might be interested in some riciculous local customs, from "tongaholiday.com":<BR/><BR/><I>"In Tongan life, the family is of utmost importance. Each family member plays a role, with older persons commanding the most respect. Women benefit from a higher social status than in other parts of Polynesia as tradition gives them certain authority over male family members. Public life, however, is still dominated by men. The eldest sister acts as the family matriarch and oversees her siblings, nieces, and nephews. Children may reside with grandparents, aunts, or uncles as often as with their parents—with multiple authority figures in their lives, most children refer to their elders by first names. Every family member helps out in the care and discipline of younger children. Tongans hold first and twenty-first birthdays, marriages, and funerals in the highest regard.<BR/><BR/>Religion closely follows the family in importance, and almost all Tongans are churchgoers. This staunchly Christian nation honours Sundays across every island group—the Sabbath is declared forever sacred in the Tongan Constitution. Almost everything (except bakeries, a few restaurants, and resorts) is closed. No sporting events take place, it is unlawful to work or trade, and most tours do not operate. Contracts signed on a Sunday are void. It is inadvisable to create any disturbance, operate noisy equipment, or be loud on Sundays. </I><BR/><BR/>What a bunch of conniving slackers! Talk about an obvious need for some saving grace...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-52900079545140490342007-05-19T17:46:00.000-07:002007-05-19T17:46:00.000-07:00Bob said,“I had had it in my mind that the desire ...Bob said,<BR/>“I had had it in my mind that the desire for liberty was a universal human wish, something built into us. Therefore, all you have to do is "give" it to people, and that will be that.”<BR/><BR/>I still think it is built in - and built-in by God of course. Maybe it seems to not be naturally there because of the eons of mind parasite layers covering it. The earliest layers placed there out of necessity for survival. Liberty because of these layers can’t operate like a light switch that you can turn on and off quickly. It must be learned and lived, as you say, to appreciate it and therefore “recognize” it again. It’s not a universal human wish because they don’t recognize it yet. Liberty has been kept from them.<BR/><BR/>So the small mistake may have been thinking it was a “wish.” Can you wish for something you don’t know exists?...or rather, if you are raised to think it doesn’t?<BR/><BR/>If liberty exists in us now, then doesn’t it mean it always existed, even if only as a potential?<BR/><BR/>I think the left can’t appreciate the gifts they have because they’ve never had to live without them. Really live without them. Not give them up willingly, but have them ripped from them.<BR/><BR/>You’ve heard this one:<BR/>Q. What’s the definition of a conservative?<BR/>A. A liberal who’s been mugged.<BR/><BR/>Mugged can mean a lot of things.<BR/>I was “mugged” when I decided to become self-employed.Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10589423819039764711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-46953747043530583532007-05-19T17:40:00.000-07:002007-05-19T17:40:00.000-07:00While I was re-reading today's post, I reached the...While I was re-reading today's post, I reached the part where Bob wrote, "Liberty is not a built in -- much less universal -- value." I recalled a time several years ago when two of my employees were about to take their tests to become American citizens. They had to memorize lots of historical facts, and they had aquired some tapes that gave them all the questions and answers on the test, so they were rehearsing for the big event every day.<BR/><BR/>This led to several conversations with me about American history, beliefs, etc. I was forever ranting about freedom and liberty, but I noticed those ideas seemed to mean little to them. It was definitely a case, as Bob wrote, that "...humans value security over liberty, predictability over change, conformity over individuality, and authority over self-rule."<BR/>Freedom and liberty were simply threats to them; ideas that fed their fears.<BR/><BR/>But what I wanted to share was that, finally, they did explain to me why they felt freedom was "muy importante." They said that, "American freedom would guarantee their right to be Mexicans in this country." This was their understanding. And they both passed the test.<BR/><BR/>All I can say is, "Same country; different worlds."walthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01388218390016612051noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-9469430712307755052007-05-19T17:23:00.000-07:002007-05-19T17:23:00.000-07:00Bob said:“Human beings had finally discovered the ...Bob said:<BR/>“Human beings had finally discovered the key to economic growth, which came down to individual liberty, free markets, strong private property rights, sound money, and the rule of law.”<BR/><BR/>This is a little beside the point of the post I think, but, you sort of left out one key that certainly was “something new under the sun”:<BR/><BR/>Civilian control of the military – which makes all the other keys possible (particularly the rule of law) without falling back toward the dictatorship we escaped. We can thank God and General Washington for realizing it and demonstrating it when he handed his sword back to Congress at the end of our Revolutionary War.<BR/><BR/>I don’t think mentioning this is picking a nit because without civilian control of the military our rule of law would be treated as any other paper…and we traitors most likely even less than paper.Rickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10589423819039764711noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-65402826593736506932007-05-19T17:18:00.000-07:002007-05-19T17:18:00.000-07:00A Tongan's tears cure cancer. Too bad they never ...A Tongan's tears cure cancer. Too bad they never cry. Ever.<BR/><BR/>A Tongan counted to one -- twice.<BR/><BR/>Hungry Tongans have already been to Mars. That's why there's no sign of life there.<BR/><BR/>The chief export of Tonga is pain.<BR/><BR/>A Tongan has two speeds, walk and stomp.<BR/><BR/>Tongans are men of few words. They are not men of few meat-slaps to the face.<BR/><BR/>The Great Wall of China was originally built to keep Tongans out. It failed miserably.<BR/><BR/>Hadrian's wall was originally built to keep Tongans out -- See Great Wall.<BR/><BR/>US immigration policy was proposed to keep Tongans out, until Tongans sent their friend Akebono to 'talk' to the Congressmen. See Great Wall.<BR/><BR/>A Tongan kicked Neo out of Zion, now Neo is "The Three" (After Chuck Norris "The Two").<BR/><BR/>Carmen Sandiego has been found, in Tongan belly.<BR/><BR/>The fat-bastard Scotsman in Austin Powers is actually a cloned "mini-me" Tongan with a pint-sized appetite.<BR/><BR/>If you have a dollar and a Tongan has a dollar, the Tongan has more money than you.<BR/><BR/>Chuck Norris is only famous because a Tongan whipped his butt.<BR/><BR/>Chuck Norris learned all his moves from a paraplegic Tongan.<BR/><BR/>Chuck Norris do roundhouse kick to the face, which tickles Tongan nose pleasantly, like a cool ocean breeze on a hot day. Tongan does roundhouse punch to the gut, which goes right through Chuck Norris body, like a roaring locomotive through a soft pat of butter.<BR/><BR/>All good Chuck Norris jokes come from Tonga.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-32296136126297385822007-05-19T15:52:00.000-07:002007-05-19T15:52:00.000-07:00Mizze - that's the funniest thing I've read today!...Mizze - that's the funniest thing I've read today!<BR/><BR/>the Bunnies - I like the distinction you make. I may have to borrow that selfist concept sometime.juliehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15975754287030568726noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-2991578938790077152007-05-19T14:28:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:28:00.000-07:00The Bunnies said "However, some people can't grasp...The Bunnies said "However, some people can't grasp that "selfist" behaviors are possible, and deried perfectly healthy instincts like the profit motive, assuming that selfishly making a lot of money will drag the rest of us down."<BR/><BR/>The leftist doesn't differentiate between them because from his point of view, in essentials, they are the same. Those essentials being that either self## has stuff that the leftist wants, and they're standing in the way of him getting it! Now!Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-26853915802104100352007-05-19T14:16:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:16:00.000-07:00BTW, I made it to nap time. One shift down. One ...BTW, I made it to nap time. One shift down. One more from 3pm - to 8pm, and then tomorrow morning from around 7am to 1pm, and I'm home free.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-65767584296245022552007-05-19T14:14:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:14:00.000-07:00This is supposed to be a very good book on the var...<A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0060580941/103-0073253-5764633?ie=UTF8&tag=onecosmos-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=1789&creativeASIN=0060580941" REL="nofollow">This</A> is supposed to be a very good book on the various political religions of the left. His new book continues the story into the 21st century and is reviewed on NRO today. Looks like he also wrote a fascinating history on the <A HREF="http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0809093251/103-0073253-5764633?ie=UTF8&tag=onecosmos-20&linkCode=xm2&camp=1789&creativeASIN=0809093251" REL="nofollow">Third Reich</A> with a similar thesis.Gagdad Bobhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14249005793605006679noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-46486752444920158412007-05-19T14:11:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:11:00.000-07:00> > 2,500 years of political theory and pretensio...> > 2,500 years of political theory and pretensions laid bare! < <<BR/><BR/>Times like these I think there's something to be said for the "Numbers".<BR/><BR/>28er got a 28er!Mizz Ehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02325435271880036807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-87429158202034953662007-05-19T14:10:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:10:00.000-07:00To prevent confusion in my own interactions with o...To prevent confusion in my own interactions with others and my writing, I've actually coined the term "selfist" to apply to that wich properly augments one's self-interest, as opposed to selfish.<BR/><BR/>A selfish person wants whatever he can get however he can get it. A selfist person wants to do well, but does so ethically, for he realizes that to satisfly himSelf he can't be exploiting others.<BR/><BR/>A selfist person, in the small groups that Bob described in his post, would probably willingly cooperate with the group because he realized that his own self-interest coincided with everyone else's, he recognizes the need for trade-offs, etc. However, a selfish person would become an enormous drain, continually sniping, stealing, etc.<BR/><BR/>Hence our conflation between "selfish" and "selfist." We both have to and should combat selfishness in its lower sense, because people doing what's in their own self-interest without an ethical framework can destroy a society. However, some people can't grasp that "selfist" behaviors are possible, and deried perfectly healthy instincts like the profit motive, assuming that selfishly making a lot of money will drag the rest of us down.<BR/><BR/>Some of us recognize that it's possible to ethically benefit oneself, and that doing so helps society. Others assume that there's nothing really wrong with theft and that to not steal when one can get away with it is a sort of self-deprivation. Most leftists can't tell the difference betweeen the behaviors and assume that CEO's must be experts at the latter behavior, for the former concept doesn't even exist to them.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-79472944970654167352007-05-19T14:05:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:05:00.000-07:00Gagster,Re nutty lefty-feminist websites: I'll see...Gagster,<BR/><BR/>Re nutty lefty-feminist websites: I'll see your Tongan, and raise you a <A HREF="http://www.nostatusquo.com/ACLU/Nikki/index.html" REL="nofollow">Nikki Craft</A>!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-72941051849444757472007-05-19T14:03:00.000-07:002007-05-19T14:03:00.000-07:00MizzE said "...no matter how hard we try to civili...MizzE said "...no matter how hard we try to civilize these glorious little creatures, there will always be that day when you realize they've been using your chapstick on the cat's butt."<BR/><BR/>OMG!!! LOL!!! <BR/><BR/>2,500 years of political theory and pretensions laid bare!Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-84777471262356480692007-05-19T13:54:00.000-07:002007-05-19T13:54:00.000-07:00Van said:....self-interest is a very interesting c...Van said:....self-interest is a very interesting concept, and I think can be used/applied in a couple ways. You can call getting, taking or earning what you want as satisfying your self interest, but it very much depends on what it is you're after.....<BR/><BR/>A story for all Moms and GagDads:<BR/><BR/>So, we had this great 10 year old cat named Jack who just recently died. Jack was a great cat and the kids would carry him around and sit on him and nothing ever bothered him. He used to hang out and nap all day long<BR/>on this mat in our bathroom.<BR/><BR/>Well we have 3 kids and at the time of this story they were 4 years old,3 years old and 1 year old. The middle one is Eli. Eli really loves<BR/>chapstick. LOVES it. He kept asking to use my chapstick and then losing it. So finally one day I showed him where in the bathroom I keep my chapstick and how he could use it whenever he wanted to but he needed to<BR/>put it right back in the drawer when he was done.<BR/><BR/>Last year on Mother's Day, we were having the typical rush around and try to get ready for Church with everyone crying and carrying on. My two boys are fighting over the toy in the cereal box. I am trying to nurse my little one at the same time I am putting on my make-up. Everything is a mess and everyone has long forgotten that this is a wonderful day to<BR/>honor me and the amazing job that is motherhood.<BR/><BR/>We finally have the older one and and the baby loaded in the car and I am looking for Eli. I have searched everywhere and I finally round the corner to go into the bathroom. And there was Eli. He was applying my chapstick very carefully to Jack's . . . rear end. Eli looked right into my eyes and said "chapped." Now if you have a cat, you know that he is right -- their little bottoms do look pretty chapped. And, frankly, Jack didn't seem to mind.<BR/><BR/>And the only question to really ask at that point was whether it was the FIRST time Eli had done that to the cat's behind or the hundredth.<BR/><BR/>And THAT is my favorite Mother's Day moment ever because it reminds us<BR/>that no matter how hard we try to civilize these glorious little creatures, there will always be that day when you realize they've been using your chapstick on the cat's butt.Mizz Ehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02325435271880036807noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8580258.post-80054615853792653682007-05-19T13:47:00.000-07:002007-05-19T13:47:00.000-07:00Susannah said "I'm reading Herotodus right now ......Susannah said "I'm reading Herotodus right now ..."<BR/><BR/><I>Yes!</I><BR/><BR/>"...and I can see the truth of this played out even among the Greeks resisting the Persian empire."<BR/><BR/><I>Even</I>?<BR/><BR/>;-)Van Harveyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08470413719262297062noreply@blogger.com